Grads? PLEASE! Sorry, Ranting Vent

"Know-it-Alls" are really annoying to those of us that actually do know it all. I have seen the zealot, actually there are more than a couple DS zealots on the main board. There are Lap-Band zealots that seem to come and go. There are RNY zealots, but they sorta get lost in the din of RNY enthusiasts :Rant ON: There are many more "My way is the Right Way" zealots, some of whom appear in this very thread shaking their heads at the others. I am a "There are more ways to skin a cat" zealot. It chaps my hide when folks authoritatively post "WE MUST..." or "WE THINK..." or "WE CAN'T ...". There is no "We". The only think even close to a Universal WLS rule is "Protein First", and I say this only because I have never heard this contradicted. Beyond this, well, things differ. Not all of us have had the same surgery. Even of those that have had RNY, we have had different amounts bypassed, different pouch shapes and sizes, different positions, different stoma sizes. On top of this, we did not all start out the same, different lengths and abilities of intestines, stomachs, and on and on. Our bodies are more different than most of us think. Not everyone is required to suppliment with protein drinks. Not everyone requires B-12 suppliments or Iron suppliments, as some people absorb these things just fine. NSAIDS are OK for many people. Time Released medications are OK for many. Some people get depressed post-op, some lose their depression post-op. Some programs call for all liquids before and after surgery, some pureed, some real food. Some do bowel clensings pre-op, some don't. Some people have drains, catheters(sp?), leak tests... some don't. Some people had surgery because of Co-Morbidities, some because they could see them coming, some because they wanted to look better, get more dates, take control of their lives, or any number of other reasons. For some people, WLS is the hardest thing they've ever done. For others, WLS was easier than falling off a log. Some people have had dire complications, others had none. For some people, throwing up is the end of the world, for others it is no big deal, for still others have yet to throw up. Some of us lose weight without exercise, others can't lose even with extreme exercise. Some hate exercise, some love it, some obsess over hating or loving it. Some boast about reaching a goal that is still Obese. Others complain about not reaching a goal that is underweight. Some accept where they are, still others never will. Soda is good and bad, Caffeine is good and bad. Candy, Pizza, Bread, Pasta, Chocolate, and any number of other things are good, bad, evil, Ok in moderation, sick-making, happy-making, never ok to eat, eating is Ok the day of surgery. Some people turn obsessively to exercise, drug and/or alcohol abuse, sex, counting carbs, protein, water, fat, calories, etc. Others, such things are not obsessions but necessary and healthy. Oh, another thing that chaps my hide is when someone respectfully disagrees and expresses the different views, they are accused of flaming, usually IN a flame. Oh, and when someone (usually 3-9 months out) is doing fine and disagrees with a longer-term opinion, and is told haughtily "When you are as far post op as *I* am, you will learn the (my) truth." BAH! You know, message boards have caused me to believe that my opinion actually matters. :Rant OFF: Tek

Tek, I Agree with you Completely, Except where I don't! Yep, I'm only intolerant of those Who are intolerant. When the wisest man in the world was asked- "Is paradox the center of all truth?" he replied- "Yes..........and No." Thanks for the great reply! Best Wishes- Dx

Wow! So now I'm thinking, am I one of those who dispenses advice with a holier than thou attitude? I hope not..I try not. I try to include "in my personal experience, my personal opinion is...., I have strong feelings about ... but (for Pete's sake and isn't it obvious), do what your doctor says to do and if he hasn't told you, call him. I try to be encouraging, but I don't and won't condone obviously destructive behavior for pre-ops or post-ops (and regretably I've learned to usually not even respond to requests to "misbehave.") Why ask for advice if you are not willing to consider several options? By the way, I truly study nutrition science now because "I want to know", and yes my blood work is great every 6 months and has been all along, and I believe in the great importance of a well balanced diet for those of us who've reached or are near goal. And I take vitamins and minerals faithfully. I still dump pretty easily and still test the limits sometimes. I threw up constantly for 3 months at first and survived in tact. Open RNY worked great for me and I have just a single short incision. I recovered fairly fast, physically, but I have a high threshold for pain and wouldn't admit to much if I had it. It's the rare person who doesn't end up with lots of sagging skin after losing a huge amount of weight and no I don't think it will shrink a reasonable amount--ever. Why am I carrying on? Final thought: I wish there was a place we could put our very best advice of experience that was required reading (completely--maybe a test at the end ) for every newbie to the site. OK, maybe not. Be willing to love yourself; you are all worth it. Ann

OH MY...could I have found a place where I could post? I dont post for this reason...I say...let them find out the HARD way..... Hi all... HEY MISHA...GOOD TO SEE YOU SIS...I had no IDEA this forum was here...where all the sensible people are... Christmas Baby

Yes ma'am, that is why I sent you a link to this forum! Good to see your profile again...now if I can just grab my plate of greasy chicken and macaroni and cheese.....LOL!!! You know I'm kidding girl!!! I'm grabbing my pound bag of M&M's!

I'm so glad you wrote this! I'm not from the South (no expectation of me being a "lady") so I'll just add - it's like she's in a freakin' cult! Whew - Thanks! Bette

A DS post-op comes to our support group toting. . . A flip chart Laminated pictures, etc A rolling suitcase full of DS 'medical stuff' . . .and proceeds to monopolize the meeting, extolling the virtues of DS and subtlety slamming all other forms of WLS. She, of course, goes on and on about how much SHE can eat, and SHE can eat whatever SHE wants, versus those poor souls who can't ever have sugar again. SHE will never dump, SHE can have all of the meat she wants at one time, SHE can - {kiss my butt}. I finally complained, and now she is limited to 5 minutes, but can set up shop in the corner so those 'undecided' can ask her questions. No, she's not a doc or even close to it (works behind the counter in a deli), but is **obviously** a DS expert. Wonder if she gets a bonus for each person she steers to her surgeon??? And who provided her all of the fancy charts and medical stuff so she can explain DS to anyone who will listen??? Hmmm. BTW - she carries on about the 50 pounds she lost with DS, but she looks like she has about another 60 to lose - and she's 3 years out! I believe it is our responsibility to encourage pre-ops to explore and thorougly research ALL options. Just because I have had a great experience doesn't mean that someone with whom I share my journey will have the same. Had my breast lift/bat wing surgery last Monday. Loving the results! This recovery is so much easier than the lower body lift. I was ready to go back to work on Wednesday, although I made myself wait until today. I think I'm becoming addicted to PS!!!! I need an intervention.

Great post, I thought initially, and wondered who you meant. After doing more digging than I should've to find out the genesis of your frustration, I figured out who it was. I'm puzzled. I've been hanging around the MB off and on since I was pre-op (over three years). Over that time, I've seen numerous posts from the person you're referring to. I've always thought her posts were among the more intelligent, well-humored, well-intentioned you see around these parts (even though she did not have the same surgery I had). None of us is perfect, and we don't all agree, and once in awhile good posters go awry, etc., but wow . . . I was just floored to see a post as strong as yours aimed at this poster. I wasn't particularly offended that she mentioned her type of surgery to a pre-op looking for protein supps, particularly because the thread that ensued was full of responses about protein shakes, etc., so that topic was covered as well. I think the idea of a Grad board here is fabulous. But I'd sure be disappointed if it turned into the type of us-versus-them (in this case, RNY versus DS) thing that we see on the Main MB from time to time. It stands to reason those who choose the DS may be concerned about avoiding pitfalls of the RNY (short- and long-term). It stands to reason those who choose the RNY over the DS are doing the same thing, based on whatever risks bug them the most, too. Given the regain concerns we ALL share, and what we've all been through pre-op. I think it's best to refrain from being too critical of each other. And I've eaten some of the same stuff she references in her profile (including bacon and pie). For sure, I don't always "refrain" (to the contrary, I must sadly admit!) I don't believe anybody *always* refrains. That's why I feel that taking hard shots at someone's profile, when they're being honest, and even reporting something you don't do (or rarely do, or try not to do), is "way harsh," even when they've posted something that really bugs you. In short, I couldn't Disagree with you More (albeit, respectfully). Suzy C.

Hi Suzy! Nice to see you show your cheery face every now and then. I was beginning to think there was only one topic that brought you of lurkdom (is that a word?) Ya know--I did some snooping after Dx posted too--and I think what we are seeing is very similar to the old RNY vs. Lap-Band stuff we saw a while ago. At least one of the people in that particular thread does make it a point to stir up trouble. I went to the DS forum and saw lots of posts talking about stirring up trouble on the main board and urging others to join in the fun. I have not visited the main board very much at all lately and I will say that I too always used to enjoy the posts of the person you referred to. But--it is frustrating to constantly have my own choice bashed and treated like I was just an ignorant person who didn't know any better when making my choice. To quote a very famous person--Why can't we all just get along? Take care and hope all is well with you. Please try and stay in touch.

Oh and one more thing--You're not perfect???? Actually, the one more thing is I definitely agree with your point about not turning this board into a us vs them board. That has always bothered me and a couple threads here have leaned in that direction--but I do think sometimes it is just people blowing off steam.