Pre-op with questions (re: foods, dumping & 'dieting' post-op, etc.)...
Hi all! I hope you don't mind me coming into your forum, but I had a few questions that only you grads can answer. I'm a pre-op RNY patient (insurance request has been submitted, just awaiting a date), but I have a few questions for all of you 'pros':
1. Can you give me an idea of an average day of food? I'm curious about quantity and types of foods. I don't expect/want to eat junk after surgery, but I'm curious about how 'normal' eating really is and if you all eat with your families or cook for them or if you're having to cook separate meals for yourselves. I do the cooking and I've already made many meals much healthier, but DH (we don't have any kiddos) is concerned about cooking 2 meals (1 for each of us) post-op. Obviously I'm not planning on making mac & cheese or ribs, etc., but I would like to maintain some sense of 'normalcy'. Hope that makes sense.
2. I'm desperately avoiding last supper syndrome, but I'm curious about dumping. Everyone says that you can eat pretty much anything after surgery, but if you dump, can you really? I don't plan on eating lots of sweets (which are my downfall and why I'm opting for RNY vs. band), but it does trouble me to think of saying goodbye to cheesecake FOREVER period. I can deal with 'goodbye for now', but goodbye forever could push that button. My psych said that you could still have 1-2 bites post-op (very rarely, of course) vs. a slab of cheesecake now, but can you REALLY do that if you dump?
3. I understand that the surgery only gets you so far (approx. 60-70% of your excess weight) and that you need to be responsible for the rest if you have a lower goal. How hard/different is it from dieting pre-op?
I really, really appreciate any input...it really helps me to ask these 'stupid' questions to those with experience. THANK YOU!
Betsey, I can only give you my experience and with all I've read from other post-ops, seems everyone's experience is different.I am two years out so I've pretty well settled into a rhythm. This is typical for me: I get up early and have a cup of coffee with a protein bar (15 grams protein) Then I try to get down a little (1/4 cup) of oatmeal with a little milk and some brown sugar on it. I also usually try to drink 1/2 cup of 1% milk.
At noon I sometimes have a piece of whole grain bread and some cheese and a half piece of fruit. Then in the late afternoon I will eat a few whole wheat crackers with some cheese or some tuna.
For supper I fix just normal stuff but I have become much more aware of the nutritional value of the food I eat. For instance, I always eat the high protein pastas now. THey have a hefty amount of protein in them. Portion size is key for me. Unless it is something very soft, or like soup, I can still only eat maybe a 1/4 cup at a time. I have to pay attention to eating enough. I can eat cookies, cake, pie in very small amounts and that is all I ever want. I can even eat candy from time to time but I have lost my love for sugar so if I want something, I usually eat 4-5 almond m&m's. I know many would be aghast at hearing this, but this is the truth! IF I haven't been able to get in enough protein, I will usually have a protein drink or bar before I go to bed.
If I eat too much sugar I will dump. I wouldn't be able to eat a whole slab of cheescake - I mean, it wouldn't go down, I don't think. One of the things I dump on regularly for some reason is potatoes. It doesn't make sense to me, but I cannot eat mashed potatoes. If I eat more than 1-2 Tblsp, I am sicker than a dog. I can't eat french fries for the same reason. I can eat baked sweet potatoes if I limit my portion size but this doesn't make sense to me. That's just the way it is and I have learned just to accept it.
I have lost 155 pounds- down to 190 from 355. If I do the math, I think that is down about 77% of my excess weight. My surgeon said you have to figure in the excess skin and attached fat when you have been as heavy as I was. In other words, I would like to lose another 25-30 pounds which would put me at about 160. Then if and when I can get PS, that would take off another 25 +/- which would certainly be as thin as I would want to ever be. I found I wasn't able to exercise though because of the damage to my knees and just had bilateral knee replacements. I'm hoping once I heal, I'll be able to start on an exercise regime that will help me lose that next 25-30 pounds. I don't really worry about dieting. I just try to concentrate on getting in enough protein and eat whole grains and the eating part seems to be taking care of itself.
Hope this helps. SuzieT
It's nice to see a pre-op here with intelligent questions, lol. Ok, here's my attempt to tell you what it's like for me. I'm 15 months post-op, I've lost 115+ lbs, still weigh 177-179 on any given day. I normally eat whatever I want, within reason, but the thing there is, what I want has changed drastically because of what I can't eat. I don't do well with sugar, at all. I can eat two hershey's kisses if I really want them, but three is too many and makes me dump. I get many of the 'typical' dumping symptoms but the worst one with refined sugar is the headache, it just pounds and pounds. Knowing how I'll feel is a BIG deterrent, I tell ya! I can tolerate some of the sugar alcohols, but some make me dump just like sugar so I try to avoid them too. As for the two or three bites of cheesecake, I can do that, just like the kisses. It still amazes me how I an now satisfied with that, lol. But I have to say, I've lost a lot of my sweet tooth(except when I'm PMSing!). Like anything else, if you don't have it, you soon get to where you don't miss it. I also dump on fats, but my tolerance for them is higher than sweets. I can eat something sauteed with some olive oil, for example, or with a pat of butter, but I can not eat fried foods. I'm glad, because they are a BIG downfall for me!
As for what I cook, I cook stuff I can eat. Meaning, lean protein and healthy veggies are the primary things I cook, and I will add a side dish for hubby and son like some rice or something that they like but I can't/won't eat. If they want mac and cheese, I make it for them. And to be quite honest, if I want a spoonful or two, I have it. But again, I don't care for the fatty taste of it that much any more. The one thing hubby gets a little aggrivated about is the things he wants that I don't cook any more, like pork chops, etc. He says it isn't fair that they have to give up all the foods they like because I can't eat them anymore. I just counter that it isn't fair to exclude me from a healthy dinner because they want junk. Eat the junk when I'm not home or go to a restaurant. Deal with it. It's not like I'm cooking nothing but boiled chicken and steamed broccoli 24/7, is it? I can make healthy, good tasting meals that we can ALL enjoy.
Now the thing about suregery getting you so far. Yea, that's true, at least for me. It got me down to about 190, and the rest has been on me. Which might explain why I'm still where I am, lol. Sometimes I'm envious of all those folks who drop right on down to 135, seemingly without a stutter. Sometimes it bugs me that I had myself gutted and re-routed and still can't seem to make it to a normal range, but... it's all on me, ya know? My love of food is still my weakness. I don't eat the volume of food I use to, but my choices are still bad sometimes. I eat a lot of cheese and I just can't do the fat free kind. I eat an apple and peanut butter for breakfast a lot of times, and I'm here to tell you, peanut butter is high calorie for a small amount! I still like to snac****asionally, and sure, the almonds are better any day than the chips, but a calorie is a calorie is a calorie. So, the struggle doens't end just because you have WLS. The good news tho? It's a heck of a lot easier sticking to a 'diet' when you don't have gnawing hunger pangs! I'm one of those who does feel hunger, but it's nothing like what it was before my surgery. No one can hear my stomach growling from across the room now, and I have to be really hungry before I can even feel it myself. So when I do commit to actually sticking to my 'plan' and eat like I'm suppose to, it's not hard to do. WLS is not a magic cure all. It's still work. But it's work with a really good assistant!
1. Can you give me an idea of an average day of food?
Read the daily check-ins to get an idea of how it goes. Many of us eat normal meals.
2. but can you REALLY do that if you dump?
I've seen some folks that are dumpers (not everyone is) that will eat something knowing they are going to dump, but consider it worth it... not me! I've had a few bites of sweets, but not really enough to know if I would dump if I over did it. I'm just not that big on sweets and never have been. I do dump on high fat items, which is my weakness, so I'm glad for that and believe me, I Avoid Them! The memory of how good that cheesecake tasted kinda gets lost when you are in the middle of a dumping episode!
3.. How hard/different is it from dieting pre-op?
For me, it's easier because I see that I can finally lose the weight. Yes, it's still hard, but you know what? It's hard for most of the folks that have always been normal sized.
Good luck!
Becky
1. Can you give me an idea of an average day of food?
First off, I'm 16 months out and I think I'm eating normal small meals now. Much different than those first 9 months. My day usually starts with about 3/4 cup of peaches and cream oatmeal with benefiber added and at least 1/2 scoop of AnyWhey Protein Mix. It's sweet enough that I don't need any kind of sweetener on it. I just mix it with ho****er but you could add slim or 1% milk to it. Weekends, I usually will have bacon and eggs and maybe a slice of whole wheat bread and maybe about 1 TBS of my husband's hashbrowns. Lunch might be a cup of chili, 1/2 hamburger or maybe even a chicken ceasar wrap. Dinner might be 1/2 grilled pork steak, 2 chicken thighs, 8 oz of spaghetti bolognese or just about anything. My husband generally eats the same thing I do. I'm a picky eater and often times I'll barbecue two different kinds of meat anyway. We eat lots of hamburger. I fix all kinds of things with that. I'll even share a baked potato, or mac and cheese, etc. with my husband. I find that I'm eating many of the same meals I used to except I don't eat chips (or very few) and I try to either stay away from the really bad carbs and fattening stuff or eat very little of it. I make sure to eat my protein first and just have very small amounts of the other dishes. If I have snacks, then it's an oz of cheese, 2 oz of peanuts, frozen yogurt, SF ice cream, or something like that. I really don't miss the other foods (chips, pastries, candy, etc.) as much as I thought I would. I will have a taste of this or that and that usually satisfies me.
2. I'm desperately avoiding last supper syndrome, but I'm curious about dumping. Everyone says that you can eat pretty much anything after surgery, but if you dump, can you really?
The first time I dumped, I had 1 barbecue chicken thigh. I had maybe a tsp of barbecue sauce and about 2 hrs later, I felt like I was drunk. The second time, I had 2 oz of fresh peaches (not canned). Now, I rarely get that drunk feeling but if I eat too many simple carbs, I feel like I could fall asleep in an instant. So I try to make sure I don't eat too many simple carbs. I'm glad that I still experience that because it helps keep me in check.
3. I understand that the surgery only gets you so far (approx. 60-70% of your excess weight) and that you need to be responsible for the rest if you have a lower goal. How hard/different is it from dieting pre-op?
The difference for me is that those early days where I wasn't hungry gave me time to both detoxify myself from sugar, carbs, etc. and allowed me time to ingrain in my head the difference between head hunger and real hunger and re-learn to eat in a much healthier manner. I could do all this without being hungry. I needed a method that would make me follow the rules or I might experience nausea, vomiting or just generally not feel well. This surgery made me learn to eat small bites slowly, not inhale my food like I used to. You still have to eat right and you should exercise, some claim they haven't exercised but I think to be a long term success you need the exercise. It increases your metabolism, helps to tone you and it's just good for you.
If I could only give you 1 piece of advice, it would be to work on your head from the get go. It's your mind that will be your biggest challenge. You need to recognize the signs of head hunger, you need to battle that depression you feel when you hit those stalls/plateaus (and you will have those), you need to be steadfast and stick to it even though it seems like you are never going to get there (but you WILL), you need to learn to be honest with yourself and be accountable, take responsibility. I could go on an on but this would turn into a novel. But,just a few more suggestions:
1. When you experience head hunger (when you crave something specific...real hunger is you just need food no matter what it is), tell yourself that you have done so well, you've lost x no. of lbs, then ask yourself if a few moments of "satisfaction" is worth all that you've worked for. Then go for a walk, drink plenty of water, anything to get your mind off it.
2. Drink plenty of water, tough at first but do the best you can and keep trying to drink more.
3. Exercise! Even if its just walking. Walking is cheap and anyone can do it. Just keep increasing the speed and distance. You might even try doing a little jogging now and again, it uses different muscle groups.
4. Set mini goals for yourself instead of looking at the whole picture. I used 2-4 lb increments but some will use clothing sizes or inches.
5. Explain to your family that you will be going thru a lot of emotional issues and you will be cranky sometimes. Also, you need to expect that your family will also be going thru alot of changes too.
Well, anyway, I told you I could write a book! So, email me if you have any questions and I'll be glad to help if I can.
Linda
I can eat pretty "normally", but if you have noticed one thing on this website, it's that everyone seems to be slightly different. I am 14 month out I started at 311 (OH MY GOODNESS) and am down to 181ish, I am still struggling with the last 25 pounds. I have not lost much in the past 2 months, but I hear those periodic plateaus are to be expected.
I have never dumped so I don't know what my sugar tolerance it AND I NEVER WANT TO FIND OUT! I taste things and I am fine, so I suspect that I may not be sugar sensitive at all, but I don't know. For example, I had half a small cup cake with frosting this weekend at a birthday party and was fine, I have no idea what would have happened if I ate the whole thing. I don't know what is scarier that I would dump or I wouldn't dump. I can eat can eat carbs and not have a problem, so I have to be careful. (I think that might be a problem with my plateau, I have been eating too many carbs lately. In fact, I am on a self imposed "carb starve" that I started today for the next 10 days trying to get over this plateau). I envy those people who are totally dedicated all the time, but sometimes I fall into old patterns and it is so important to recognize them and STOP IT before it gets out of hand. Hey, we are only human.
So, yes, you gotta do the work too, but you will have the advantage of having this awesome tool. My honeymoon period is definitely over. It's not as hard as before surgery because, for me, "the monkey is off my back", I can't compulsively binge, I am afraid to eat garbage food and most importantly, YOU NEED TO EAT FOR RESPONSIBLY FOR GOOD HEALTH. When you stop to think about how important proper nutrition is now and what can happen if you don't get it, it really helps you choose wisely. Chips don't seem as appetizing when you thing about the affects of malnutrition.
I don't cook separate meals for my family/friends. I can have any kind of meat, veggies and "side dish". I just prepare everything healthy which is better for everyone anyway. Then I will just pass on the side dish, for now, (rice or potatoes) and stick to lean meats (baked, broiled or grilled) and veggies (steamed or boiled). Last time I made dinner for my gorgeous boyfriend, (that I would have never met at 311 pounds), I made pan seared scallops, brown rice, steamed veggies with garlic sauce and a salad. I ate about a cup of salad, (lettuce crunches up real small and doesn't take up much pouch room) 4 scallops, a couple of snow pea pods and maybe a fork full or two of rice. Tonight it's just me and I will make broiled chicken and lentils. I really enjoy cooking so it has been fun experimenting with different food and recipes.
This may sound strange, but make sure you enjoy the process and take time to stop and be grateful for the new healthy life style you will have.
Oh, by the way, I am a card carrying member of the "last supper club", my advice, DON'T DO IT! I put on about 15 pounds before surgery and I could have just kicked myself for it! It was senseless and others have told me that, but I did it anyway. If you get caught up in it you will just regret it like I do.
I have posted a tremendous amount of info on my profile on my food plan.
I have stopped looking at the daily what did you eat today posts, as I found that some of them were (and I hope no one gets offended but am going to be totally honest) I was getting personally disturbed by many of them, so for my own emotional sanity had to stop looking at them. many of them resembled eating plans on pro ANA, pro MIA websites for people who see anorexia and bulemia as lifestyle choices rather than eating disorders. I was going thru a period of really struggling with food issues, body image issues and depression and needed to enter therapy and it took a lot for me to see that *some* of the people were not role models, but were either lying about their intake or very sick.
I am nearly 4 years out so my quantites are not what a new person would eat. but the balance is similar to what I have been doing all along, just larger portions now that I am at a HEALTHY weight and maintaining.
I have always done 6 meals a day. I started early on when I had no hunger and had to put myself ion a schedule to be sure I was eating what I needed. I am so glad I established certain habits early on, as it has helpd me to be ok once hunger kicked in strong again. By eating 6 meals a day, I avoid getting really hungry and make better choices.
At 4 years out I eat between 1500-1700 cal a day. ( I work out a LOT) I aim for a calorie breakdown of 40-30 - 30. 40% of my cals from carbs, 30% protein, 30% fats. that is aproxamately 150 grams carb, 110 grams protein and 50 grams fat. per day. to simplify. I average 6 oz meat, fish or chicken. 3 - 1 cup servings of milk or yogurt or cottage cheese, or 1 oz serving of cheese. 2 fruits every day(1 is always a banana) 2-4 servings of high fiber bread or cereal. (1/2 large slice of bread or 1/2 c cereal) and 2+ veggies a day. I do not limit veggies. I eat a handful of nuts or TB peanut butter 4-5 times a week. I break these up over my 6 meals a day and I usually try to plan ahead for the day, and keep a runnung list in my head so I know by dinner that I need X amount of meat, or dairy etc before I go to bed that night. most days I do have some form of treat, sf pudding, sf fudgecicle, etc. I logged on fit day for months to figure out my best plan.
If I want a bite of cheese cake I have one, after I have had a good portion of protein. I occasionally dump, and it is unpredictable. I might dump on something I have eaten many times ie. grapes & pineapple, or not dump on something I think I should.. I went into it thinking there were so many foods I would never have ever again. IE I went to all my favorite restaurants and had my favorite stuff one last time preop. now I laugh at myself for thinking it was never again. I had to go have a blooming onion, a steak italian food, sushi, etc at my fave places. and now I can eat a bite or two of most things with out a problem. the problem arises if I take too many bites. But, I also keep in mind that these things are special treats, not for every day or even every week. I eat some thing fried a couple times a year, and if I want a cheese cake for my birthday I have a few bites. and I have sushi almost every week.
the biggest thing for me is getting over the all or nothing mentality. to realize I can be a healthy normal person and eat like a healthy normal THIN person. that doesnt mean pigging out on junk, it means occsional small treats.
My best advice, read the book, "how much does your soul weigh?" by Dorie McCubbrey and consider therapy sooner rather than later. All of these changes you are about to undertake are HUGE beyond anyting I ever imagined. there has been good and bad and a LOT to adjust to. email me if you want to talk and /or need support at any time. HUGS and congrats on the first steps on your journey to healthy living!
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