Scary Stuff Going On Here.......

Ahh... internet forums.... one step forward, two-and-a-half steps back.

I'm always amazed at how someone can turn a general discussion inward on themselves.  For instance:

Me:  In general, I think it's prudent for people to save up cash in cases of financial emergency.

Other forum person:  How DARE you presume to tell me what to do with my money!!!  You think I don't know what to do with my money?  You think I don't care about my own financial future!?!  I came here for support, not to be discouraged blah blah blah.

We can attempt to have discussions of the big picture, but someone will always infer you're specifically talking about them, and another person will read that you're mean and telling them they are destined to fail.  It's amazing!  I've seen this reaction in other posts, here and on other forums, not just in Frisco's thread.  For certain things that people invest in, it's nearly anathema to bring up the possibility of failure - you do that, and suddenly your unsupportive.  Frisco is "unsupportive" even though he's calling on us (patients, surgeons) to help raise standards to increase success- the irony!  Boy, try reminding people that the average VSG patient does not reach 100% excess weight lost - people will flame you because you're not supporting them.  Reality is now unsupportive.

Congrats on your future end-of-pregnancy weight success - the great thing is you do know you'll hit your goal!!!

If this is a double post, I apologize!

It's the same trends I've witnessed more and more over the last year. Surgery doesn't fix everything, coddling bad behavior isn't going to get anyone very far, encouraging and supportive behavior is all about perception, and I'm not going to sugarcoat life post-op while losing or while in maintenance. Nor will I sugarcoat information when someone does post about not losing, slow losing, but they refuse to make changes to what they put in their mouths because some nutritionist told them to eat more calories, no****ch carb intake, and just eat smaller portions. My theory is "If it's not working, stop doing it and find what does work". If that worked, I would not have had 85% of my stomach removed. If someone wants to lose slowly, eat whatever they want in smaller portions since their sleeve is so tight at 3 months out, and not make the necessary changes in behavior to have success then who am I to argue with their logic. Let them do it their way is my attitude at this point. When they come back in 12-18 months, stalled out, haven't made goal, eating double the portions they were at 3-6 months out, and found out that little slider foods go down way easy and those portions of "not so bad foods" are a bigger part of their life than protein and nutrient dense meals, maybe they'll reconsider what that nutritionist told them wasn't the Holy Bible of bariatric success. Each patient has to find what works for their whole life, not just the losing stage because life after losing isn't all daisies and rainbows.

I'm not anyone's therapist, never claimed to be, and those of us who come here for support and encouragement need different types of comments and support. No one can or should make you feel a certain way UNLESS you ALLOW IT. It's an internet forum for God's sake, I seriously do not get the comments about being made to feel guilty, stupid, or any other emotion based on comments from a perfect stranger on an internet forum. I personally rarely reply to posts about stalls, or eating off plan during the losing or healing stage anymore. There's plenty of others who can relate to what those posters are going through, and since I can't, I avoid those topics for the most part. I might read them, but I'm 98% sure I won't reply. I also figure everyone here is smart enough to employ the private message feature, and if someone "really" wants to discuss stuff then I'll get a message. I, like Elina, get messages all the time privately regarding these specific issues. I'm always open to talking frankly with someone *****ally wants to be successful. For those who want to be coddled, not work the sleeve, find ways to cheat and eat around it, I'm sure there are others out here who can support that behavior. I can not and will not do it.

Losing was super easy for me. Getting the losing to stop was tricky, maintenance wasn't horribly difficult, and now with a 35lb gain during pregnancy, dropping 22-23lbs of that weight was easy, now these last few pounds aren't budging. SO, what am I doing??? 1) I'm getting through the holidays without stressing 2) After we get back from vacation, I'm going straight back to low carbing it and losing this weight because that is what works for me, and I know that I can and will drop the weight.

From some of the responses, it kind of feels that the feeling here this is only a place for new people to ask questions, and post their concerns i think thats sad.

This should be a board for people from all phases of their Journey whether it be someone looking into surgery, someone pre op, someone post op, and also people at maintaining or people using this as a support group.

all discussions should be welcome whether we like whats being said or not, because how to learn if something is not talked about.?   I dont see Friscos observations as something that is pointing fingers. we dont have to agree with his observations but it doesnt change it from being something he sees.
he has not named anyone it was a general statment that was not pointed at any particualr op or surgeon.

If we are secure in our decision of going forward with the VSG,  and the surgeon as we should be  It should not bother us if someone is saying something that is different.. There is no one set of rules for this surgery as is seen daily on the boards.. from the time in hospital to the diets we are given to follow..  If you have a program that is detailed and you trust the surgeons and nuts advice your being given then follow it  
if your struggling and need help then definatly ask, sometimes trying new things helps because its not always the same for all.

My advice is dont be too keen to close ears to what others are saying even if you dont like it, because some where futher down the track that advice they were sharing maybe what you need.

Very well said Frisco, I totally agree with your observation. It may come across as harsh to some people but anyone that has been around long enough knows it is out of genuine concern, it may not be sugar coated but it needs to be said.

Keep up the good work my friend!!
John

 Wow people are testy today :)
While I dont agree that 1 plan works for everyone (we all have different food issues, different comorbidities, different metabolisms, etc) I think that we all come here for guidelines and advice - which is all that you should expect. Use the info you get or dont - it is your choice. Always good to hear from those who have had success. Will their way work for all of us - maybe and maybe not. You are in control of your own journey, but isnt it great to be able to get different oppinions and hear what has worked for others? 

I think we should all be aware of the fact that what we give and get here are opinions and experiences - take what works for you and ignore the rest. 

 This is a great observation and plenty of good advice and information. Everyone has to remember that this is a site where you can get information it doesn't mean that it is something that replaces a doctors advice and you need to take all that you read with a grain of salt.

GOD BLESS

RAQUEL

"I think this board is somewhat of a scarier place for newbies than it used to be. I dont' think it's bad, but I definitely feel the hesitation in some posters. On one hand, it shouldn't have to be like that because we need a good mix of newbies, middles and vets to make this board as awesome as it can be. But on the other hand, I read some things that blow my mind and I can't even comprehend. Which is why some folks bring out the tough love and then some folks take the the wrong way." - sillysweet

....my thoughts exactly! It's hard to communicate electronically-so much gets lost in translation (this thread is a great example). And so in an effort to not offend/sound criticizing, I usually just don't respond...and that's what makes this board a little sad to me. The folks with experience, who want to pay it forward, hesitate to respond publicly because they will appear as a know-it-all or inadvertently touch a nerve and get bashed....But what happens to the folks that use OH to learn from the experienced? Who will give them guidance/support? ....

....so I agree, I want everyone to feel welcome on the boards. I want folks to feel encouraged to share their good and bad experiences. I want to build a spirit of togetherness. And I will try to contribute in a positive manner any way I can...

.....at the same time, I loathe when we harp on vets for sharing their thoughts (whatever they may be). It does nothing except drive them away. Think about it: the vets have made goal. They come back here 90% to help pull others out of the state they were in, 10% to keep their head in the game. If they are constantly beraded, there is 0% incentive to return. Could you imagine an exodus of vets? OH would cease to be a learning tool!....

...I can't be mad at Frisco, because he has always come from a position of wanting to help fellow sleevers. And I hope that despite these rough patches, that he and others will continue to frequent the board and continue to be an inspiration...

...i wish everyone the best on their journies!

I love hearing from the vets and I do totally agree with a lot of what was said because I think the surgeries have turned into a big business where some surgeons want to make money and don't care too much about aftercare. I can't comment on how things were 2 years ago but I would assume trends would change because of the influx of surgeries and lax requirement.  I think there should be more standardized post op requirements. It's difficult to navigate so many successful experiences, especially when you're behind a computer and you don't have the actual surgeon, dietician, support group, etc to back that specific information or support you through the process. Regardless of the research I did, I am a little pissed that I am sitting here with a vague meal plan that I don't feel comfortable with and now *I* feel that MY success may be lessened. My nerve was definitely touched by the combination of the original post and a following post that sounded like it made reference to one of my posts and my situation. Considering the fact that I feel so vulnerable and lost as a new post op not knowing what to do at this stage, I am emotional. In addition, I still haven't found the answer to my "what should I do?" question so I feel extra dumb and lost! But anyway, my point is, I do agree with some of what was being said in the original post and the people who have met goal DO have invaluable information to share with everyone (what info would there be if there was no one to pass on their experiences??), sometimes things just come off as negative or putting a line between the newbies and vets and it's discouraging especially when you're new and confused.

My bad for taking it personal.

 
OK shwag.....

Please do not take this the wrong way.......

- First.....The VSG is not Standardized....both the surgery, eating plans or aftercare. Over time and popularity all aspects have become increasingly varied. (part of my point)

- And honestly.....again...don't take this wrong.....your situation that you have described is scary.

This is not a put down you....It's a situation you brought to light and it doesn't sound ideal.

The only thing I can recommend is the LapSF manual. I don't really remember now what I was eating or how your going to modify your plan......

frisco