Scary Stuff Going On Here.......

 I’d love to know where I impinged on your character please enlighten me.

 I was simply stating that we are having 2 conversations, and that it is difficult to come to a consensus when the people in the conversation aren’t even on the same page as to what the conversation is about!

 

 You are posting about trends and changes.  I haven’t been here long enough to comment on that.  Many people, from what I am reading are upset because they feel you are saying they shouldn’t ask questions or that they are stupid (I don’t feel you said that but I can see where they’d get it from).  That’s not what I read though.  I feel you said that you are seeing more people come who are uneducated in what they have had done or surgeons who don’t care enough to give proper guidance and that scares you for what the numbers might show for this surgery. 

 

My point was strictly, I’m not sure what good this conversation does in this forum.  People tend to get defensive when told they are ignorant.  It may be a true statement but they’ll turn off everything else you say after just because you said they were ignorant.  I’m not sure saying there are more people who are ignorant coming here does any sort of good?  I know helping someone in a forum with a specific problem is of course helpful, even if it is a knock upside the head.  But a blanket, more people are coming here who don’t know anything, I just don’t see what purpose it serves in THIS forum.  I can see it as a conversation among the old timers in your maintenance board, but as its been proven by this thread, it doesn’t do much but **** people off and not in a I’m going to go get more information way but in a screw you I’ll go somewhere else or nowhere at all way.

 
Hey hrford..... I think I did a bad.....I musta hit reply in your post...meaning it was directed at you....Sorry my bad. Must post was meant for general consumption....not at you....

But after reading your post......where did I call someone ignorant?

Sorry,

frisco

 I was using the 2nd definition for my use, I assume you will find that an accurate use of the word.

ig·no·rant/ˈignərənt/  

Adjective:

Lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or unsophisticated. Lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about something in particular: "ignorant of astronomy".

 
I guess......probably could come up with a few more words.....

I also think your making some very creative assumptions.....

frisco

Excellently said, and I really appreciate the fact that you are behind the scenes answering people's PMs, calling, that is so awesome!! Like I said, I really really appreciate all of the VETS here that are helping, encouraging, offering advice, etc. Thank you!!

I absolutely had to chime in here...seriously, way to go Frisco!  My point here is that Frisco has made each of us think about this, get mad about it, feel passionate about what we're doing and he's definitely stirred the pot!  He loves to stir the pot!  His comments were general, not personal...and his final comment has truth in it..."If you don't try.....It's gonna be hard to do this...."  If you ask me, that's encouragement.  I think he just wants you to keep thinking about your choices and not be one of the ones who fade out.  Take what you need from the post and if he says something that offends (maybe that comment is food for thought - if you'll excuse the pun) or doesn't apply to you, discard it.  I truly think Frisco wants everyone to succeed and be mindful of their decision and stay the course.  Happy Holidays to you all!

Peace Out!

Deb

 
Thanks Deb,

Great post....you got me wired !!!

frisco

I've noticed a lot of the same here lately.  I now see why the vets get frustrated.  I'm not a vet, but I'm much more into "giving back" to the forum now as opposed to the "asking and needing information" that I was a few months ago.  Both are perfectly acceptable.  I personally appreciated the people who stuck around and answered my newbie questions.  And now I'm trying to do some of the same where I think I can help. 

I want everyone to succeed at this and unfortunately, there is probably going to be a percentage of people who don't.  Some through no fault of their own, and some because they don't know how or don't want to do what it takes.

I'm taken aback at some of the things I read on this board.  Common sense stuff that people claim they don't know.  Or bury their head in the sand so that they can't know.  Mostly I don't comment on those posts because I don't even know how to approach it and be helpful (which is always my intent). 

I think this board is somewhat of a scarier place for newbies than it used to be.  I dont' think it's bad, but I definitely feel the hesitation in some posters.  On one hand, it shouldn't have to be like that because we need a good mix of newbies, middles and vets to make this board as awesome as it can be.  But on the other hand, I read some things that blow my mind and I can't even comprehend.  Which is why some folks bring out the tough love and then some folks take the the wrong way.

Enough rambling.  I don't even know if I had a point in there other than to say that there are some great points made by Frisco and Elina in recent posts.  And I hope they and the other vets stick around.

Frisco,

I agree with you on all points. Weight loss with the VSG or any other process is a numbers games consisting of calories consumed vs. calories burned. You're never going to lose weight if you consume more calories than you're utilizing.

As for carbs, most of us who have or need WLS have issues with carbs. I'm more than 2 years post-op and have maintained my weight loss but I still monitor my carbs. I expect to always have to be diligent about my carb consumption, I still track my food, but I don't mind this. I expected to change the way I eat by having this surgery. 

Prior to the VSG I was hungry all the time and always thinking about what I was going to eat next. Since the VSG I'm rarely hungry and when I think about food it's about how to meet my goals for the day regarding protein, water and limited carbs.

Losing weight and keeping it off takes a conscious effort. It will not happen on its own.

George

It's the same trends I've witnessed more and more over the last year. Surgery doesn't fix everything, coddling bad behavior isn't going to get anyone very far, encouraging and supportive behavior is all about perception, and I'm not going to sugarcoat life post-op while losing or while in maintenance. Nor will I sugarcoat information when someone does post about not losing, slow losing, but they refuse to make changes to what they put in their mouths because some nutritionist told them to eat more calories, no****ch carb intake, and just eat smaller portions. My theory is "If it's not working, stop doing it and find what does work". If that worked, I would not have had 85% of my stomach removed. If someone wants to lose slowly, eat whatever they want in smaller portions since their sleeve is so tight at 3 months out, and not make the necessary changes in behavior to have success then who am I to argue with their logic. Let them do it their way is my attitude at this point. When they come back in 12-18 months, stalled out, haven't made goal, eating double the portions they were at 3-6 months out, and found out that little slider foods go down way easy and those portions of "not so bad foods" are a bigger part of their life than protein and nutrient dense meals, maybe they'll reconsider what that nutritionist told them wasn't the Holy Bible of bariatric success. Each patient has to find what works for their whole life, not just the losing stage because life after losing isn't all daisies and rainbows.

I'm not anyone's therapist, never claimed to be, and those of us who come here for support and encouragement need different types of comments and support. No one can or should make you feel a certain way UNLESS you ALLOW IT. It's an internet forum for God's sake, I seriously do not get the comments about being made to feel guilty, stupid, or any other emotion based on comments from a perfect stranger on an internet forum. I personally rarely reply to posts about stalls, or eating off plan during the losing or healing stage anymore. There's plenty of others who can relate to what those posters are going through, and since I can't, I avoid those topics for the most part. I might read them, but I'm 98% sure I won't reply. I also figure everyone here is smart enough to employ the private message feature, and if someone "really" wants to discuss stuff then I'll get a message. I, like Elina, get messages all the time privately regarding these specific issues. I'm always open to talking frankly with someone *****ally wants to be successful. For those who want to be coddled, not work the sleeve, find ways to cheat and eat around it, I'm sure there are others out here who can support that behavior. I can not and will not do it.

Losing was super easy for me. Getting the losing to stop was tricky, maintenance wasn't horribly difficult, and now with a 35lb gain during pregnancy, dropping 22-23lbs of that weight was easy, now these last few pounds aren't budging. SO, what am I doing??? 1) I'm getting through the holidays without stressing 2) After we get back from vacation, I'm going straight back to low carbing it and losing this weight because that is what works for me, and I know that I can and will drop the weight.