The ethics lacking I agree.

However, what peered review journal is going to publish "One competitor finds another's vitamin patches not having sufficient quality control" Never going to happen.

Now, if there was MANY different types of patches from numerous suppliers, people might look at absorption and variability across brands, races, gender and etc. and perhaps have the intra-batch variability of each brand of patch assessed.

However, using a peer-reviewed journal to police your competitor...not going to happen.  One would think that is job for FDA but again...supplements are not held to the same standards as drugs.

SO really- NO ONE IS LOOKING OUT FOR US.

Yet there is research examining efficacy of various treatment regimens. So approaching this correctly is not outside the realm of possibility. 

Exactly. I've found a couple of university researchers taking on a comparison of patch vitamins vs traditional vitamin regime in bariatric patients to determine their efficacy (with a focus on those who have malabsorptive surgeries). Apparently results will be published in 2017. They aren't huge samples (but def more than 1!), but to assume the only people researching these claims would be competitors doesn't make much sense.

also, I don't think anyone claimed the patches to be fool proof, (in fact when I asked about the patch a month ago, I got feedback from people with both positive and negative with regard to their labs.)

the question I have is how does the patch "failure" rate compare to a traditional oral vitamin regime. There is plenty of info that shows oral vitamins aren't 100% effective in all cases either. Time will tell.

I agree we need to be sceptical of new products in an unregulated industry, but to dismiss people's positive results as annecdotal, while embracing the results of a test on a single patch by direct competitor is odd to say the least.

the question I have is how does the patch "failure" rate compare to a traditional oral vitamin regime.

-This is great news about the university.

And that is a good question!  As you pointed out, we are malabsorbing. Chances are a mixture of the two modalities will work best (i.e. patch and oral). 

I am looking forward to these studies!

Thanks for letting us know!

So how do we get OH to fund such a study. Maybe get Dr. Nazhar on it.

I dont mean to be snippy. I use a LOT of vitamin lady supplements and D3 (to aid absorption). Yet a few vertbrate on my back are showing OSTEOPENIA . Yay being 40!

Some of those in my medical group, allege it is "the quality of vitamin".  As a scientist, I would agree that proteins/hormones have issues with conformation that may get disrupted that affects absorption (i.e. a quality issue). But calcium.

At any rate if the calcium quality WERE real, to my understanding vitamin lady has one of the best. So if her's are **** by one practioners standards, where can I get BETTER?

Maybe I just want an easy monopoly where there are a limited amount of KNOWN suppliers that have an awesome product that deliver what they say they are going to deliver every single time (like a drug).

-Skinny.  

Who doesnt have just vitamins. She has a "supplement arsenal"!!!

I would love that but can't see OH being interested in that, as it would be seen as pitching their sponsors against each other. Finding reliable information is a long term challenge for us wls'ers. I will always be very sceptical of any report or study funded by people with a vested interest in the outcome. 

The Bariatric clinic I'm a patient at is part of a research and teaching hospital. They provided me with a list of specific brands they've researched and believe to be the best choices (at this time). So I'm sticking with that for now. 

I would love if supplements were regulated as drugs. Or if there was a hoop they could jump through so certain brands could be labeled "medical grade" . 

Would it be possible for you to PM the brands of the supplements? 

For sure! I'll send it along when I get home tonight. And thanks for you contribution to this discussion!

Would it be possible to list specific brand supplements for all of us to see?

I like the concept of them... patches have been used for years as a way to administer medications... sea sickness, pain, birth control. My issue really has been wondering who is regulating them... does anyone know, I read through the thread but didn't see any mention? 

(From the FDA website) "The law defines dietary supplements in part as products taken by mouth that contain a "dietary ingredient." Dietary ingredients include vitamins, minerals, amino acids, and herbs or botanicals, as well as other substances that can be used to supplement the diet. Dietary supplements come in many forms, including tablets, capsules, powders, energy bars, and liquids. These products are available in stores throughout the United States, as well as on the Internet..."

Patches would not fall under this definition of dietary supplement... so do they have to go through the process that a drug transdermal patch needs to go through for approval? Eeek that is some process as I understand it, clinical trials, lots of red tape. Do these fall into a gray area? IDK.

Anyway... I had too many questions about them and I enjoy my chewables so I'm continuing to take those and I get a Dr administered B12 shot once a month. I am of the mindset that something is better than nothing... so if you weren't taking your oral vits for some reason I guess it's better than nothing, maybe? I'm not a big science person but I always thought some vits need water, some fats to dissolve/absorb? Well so PSA to my fellow WLSers is always watch those labs no matter what you use... sounds like some people are finding benefit from them so yay for them... oh and... I'll add despite taking vitamins faithfully you can have a deficiency come up (double edged sword of malabsorption) so again labs checks are a must... I personally would want a few more answers if I used them (and not from someone profiting from the selling or not selling of them... thinking ASMBS needs to weigh-in, at the very least your bariatric team.)