Dr. Garth Davis' view on protein

tiger

we are 2 days apart and congrats on your amazing weight loss!  I too feel much better at 60-70 gms of protein which is what was recommended for me and then fruits and veggies and which comes first depends on what my body is craving that day.  Right now with all the fresh fruits in abundance, my body is craving fruits more than veggies!  The point is I am finally learning what my body wants and needs to be healhty!  Oh and I had a Sf choc chip cookie yesterday and it was divine!  One satisfied me whereas in the past I would have eaten a dozen or more, LOL

My surgeon gives each of his patients a program and every person has a different amount of protein.  Mine was 59gm of protein a day and I think it is based on height and I am 5'2.  He does not recommend 80-100gms a day.

He was the featured speaker at the WLSFA Meet and Greet Saturday luncheon this past weekend and I think this post is timely (and I was going to post what he said myself, so I appreciate the conversation).  In his speech, he said the same thing. I asked 2 questions and he answered them both more thoroughly in this post. I asked: why are we recommended 80+ grams of protein a day, and if we don't need that much, what do you recommend? And if we want to move away from chemical protein shakes, what can we replace them with?

He gave the short version of his facebook post as the answer to my first question and he said that we do NOT need to drink protein shakes or supplements as an RNY post-op. He said to make smoothies full of veggies and fruits and drink those instead. He said there is no reason, except for the protein shake companies telling us to, that we need to drink protein drinks. 

He talked about the "blue zones" where people live to be 100 and said that our post-op llifestyle should resemble theirs: low to no animal protein, diets full of veggies, fruits, beans, whole grains (all organic), low to no dairy, some fish like wild alaska salmon (not farmed) with continuous sustainable movement and exercise, surround ourselves with people who make us feel good and provide good companionship, drink water and get good sleep. He said we should aim for 30-40 grams of veggie, fruit, bean and whole grain fiber per day. He said "unlimited" good carbs.

He also talked about the moral choices we make with our food: if we eat chicken that isn't organic and free range from a local farm (meaning it is factory farmed), we are supporting cruelty and environmental destruction. Same with cows - milk and beef. He also said to avoid factory farmed chicken and beef because of the antibiotics and hormones in them (and I concur - a total public health ticking time bomb).

I appreciated hearing a doctor and nutrition advocate speaking about the moral choices we make with our food and how those work to keep us healthy or not, too. We are healthier when we aren't eating hormone and antibiotic laced chicken breasts and our environment is too, which then makes us healthier.

He was great and this one speech has changed my post-op nutrition focus. At our house, we only eat organic food, non-factory farmed locally grown meat, fresh wild alaska salmon, and it was great to hear a doctor speak about the benefits from a whole health perspective and that this is the healthiest way forward from multiple perspectives: body, moral, environmental, etc.

He said that he sees too many post-ops who don't look healthy, who have bad skin and hair and whose bodies look unhealthy even though they've lost tons of weight. He said that our goals need to be to look and feel healthy by following this kind of lifestyle.

I like the fact that he brought up the  moral/ethical issues related to diet, too.  I wasn't aware that he advocated a more humane diet.

I have to say that really, I don't think eating animals is very humane regardless of how you do it.  Certainly it's kinder to raise chickens in on a free range farm and slaughter them as quickly and painlessly as possible - but you are still killing them, so while it may be "more humane" it's still cruel, in my opinion.  I buy raw milk from a local farm, which I believe is much more humane than milk from factory farms, but there are still a lot of ethical issues involved and I do believe it would be much kinder to just not drink milk.  However, I really like dairy products and they do make it much easier to get my protein in (the amount of protein I believe I need in order to be healthy) so it's a compromise I make for now that i feel I can live with. 

I think the antibiotics and hormones in milk are really unhealthy and that's another reason I get milk where I do - I definitely don't want to be putting that stuff in my body.  It has also been very interesting to me to learn from the farmer I get milk from about how he handles the milk to make sure it's safe even though it's not pasteurized - and by comparison, how likely the pasteurized milk you buy at the grocery store is to make you sick.  For instance, he told me the USDA says farmers must refrigerate milk within two hours of when it comes out of the cow.  Can you imagine leaving milk sit for two hours in at room temperature, then drinking it?  Especially when room temperature is a hot barn in the summer?  He tells me his milk hits the cooling tank within 15 minutes at most.  But how can milk be good for you to drink if it sits out for two hours in the summer time?

Anyway, I wish I had the chance to talk with him because I really have some questions.  I'm wondering if what is unnecessary or even unhealthy is getting too much protein from any source or getting too much animal protein?  I get about 90 grams of protein a day and that's how much it takes to keep the protein and albumin levels in my blood in the middle of the reference range.  So I really would like to know if he thinks my levels don't really need to be that high or if he just thinks most post ops would not need that much protein to keep their levels that high?  And I think my hair and skin and everything looks just fine, even though I get that much protein.

I agree with you that eating animals isn't humane, but just the thought that I'm eating beef from a cow that stood in its own feces for its entire miserable life makes me sick. Or the thought that the chicken breast I'm eating came from a chicken who was stuffed with food and hormones so its breasts would grow and sat and crapped on all the other chickens in their cramped cages for its short miserable life makes me sick, too. If I'm eating meat, I want to know where it came from, who raised it and how it came to my plate. I care about the environmental destruction from factory farms, too.  I think people have this expectation that meat and dairy needs to be cheap, and that expectation is destructive on a number of levels.

He seems to be answering questions on his Facebook page, or at least reading people's comments. Perhaps you might have luck communicating with him there.

Oh, I agree.  I want to know where my food comes from, too.  And of course I wish food was cheaper but it costs more to raise healthy food in a humane way.  I pay $25 a month and for that I get one  gallon of organic raw milk once a week.  I'm willing to pay that.

He recommended Engine2, 21daykickstart, and Eat to Live as programs to get us started on plant based diets.

I looked at 21daykickstart from the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine and it looks doable and delicious!

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My max is 60 grams since day one, because once my PCP warned me that too much protein was bad for my diabetic kidney's I figured it would be bad for my non diabetic kidneys also.  Plus there is a link between too much animal protein and kidney stones.  I always feel too much of a good thing isn't a good thing.  I try to eat protein forward, lean meat, low fat cheese, nuts, beans, eggs, Greek Yogurt.     I think every diet has to be balanced to work.  No one food group can be healthy for us.

Maybe I will have a nice salad for dinner tonight.  Sounds like a good idea.