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ObesityHelp is a bariatric surgery website, which they openly state. >.>
As for myself, surgery saved my life and my sanity. I would choose it again in a heartbeat. I also value fasting and ketogenic diets, too, that you mention.
I've lost over 460 pounds. 300ish of those were by diet alone pre-op. At that point I was unable to lose more despite fasting, being on very low carb diets, etc. The only way I lost weight, and very slowly at that, was eating calories lower than many of us do after surgery, which caused me severe issues. I don't talk about this much, however I was, in fact, violently anti-WLS for many years. After getting over myself, I threw myself into researching surgery, and I discovered that it was very useful for many people, and, in fact, most people are very happy with it. Is surgery for everyone? Absolutely not. However, for many of us it works well enough that it's restored significant numbers of people to normal healthy weights after they were obese.
I'm familiar with Fung's work, and I'm one of the moderators on the Ketogenic Forums which are run by Richard and Carl. Carl also edits the new IDM podcast. Thus, I am very familiar with IF and fasting, perhaps more than the average person. I also don't talk about this much as I prefer to keep my forum realms separate and I don't want anyone to think I am needlessly handwaving as I pontificate enough. I only mention this now so you can understand that my opinions about surgery and ketogenic diets are both informed and well-researched.
I chose to have surgery. I had tried everything - fasting and ketogenic diets included. I'm a Zen Buddhist and used to fast 7-30 days at times. Again, I also used to weigh 750 pounds, 300+ of which I lost from following low carb (primarily ketogenic/zero carb) diets, so I know a lot about walking the talk. I have been on low carb diets for over ten years. I lost a lot of weight...however I began stalling and could no longer lose at a decent pace unless I cut my calories so low the doctor wanted to see me multiple times a week (300 calories). I am severely and intractably insulin resistant.
It is true that fasting can effect benefits similar to WLS, actually. However, there are stark differences.
For starters, the changes are significantly greater with surgery. Fasting and ketogenic diets *can* reverse T2 diabetes and reduce A1C. My A1C went from 11 to 6 with diet alone. However, my A1C refused to drop lower no matter what I did. After several months of only losing 2-3 pounds a month and being utterly miserable with being unable to eat anything aside from protein powder in order to stay super low calorie but still get my protein I needed, I took another look at surgery.
Fasting and such does not cause a permanent alteration to glucose metabolism. Most people also typically are all over the place diet-wise. Very few people on ketogenic diets do reduce their obesity; oh a lot lose weight. Some lose hundreds of pounds and do very well. For a variety of reasons, though, surgery works well for the majority of the obese...even more so than a ketogenic diet and fasting.
Surgery also works faster and the changes are stronger and more resilient. It immediately begins to reverse insulin resistance by permanently changing the enteroendocrine hormones that regulate obesity. A gastric bypass, for instance, cures diabetes in a matter of days. Several insulin dependent people can go off insulin usually after a few weeks if they are type 2. Surgery works very well, particularly the duodenal switch.
Having said that, while I understand your frustrations, I do not think that slamming surgery is going to get you the fellowship you seek. It's just as ruthless as people who may have shoved surgery down your throat. Forums typically serve populations that request services and that is how they manifest changes. Why don't you start fasting groups or ketogenic groups if that's what you want here? If you don't want to do that there are many other places as well.
There are many options and everyone must be well-informed and well-educated to make them. While you may not like it, surgery is one such option that has done many more people good than ill. Regardless, good luck finding what you are looking for. I hope you're able to find the change and support you need.
I follow a ketogenic diet post-op. I also have a diagnosis of binge eating disorder. Feel free to ask me about either!
It is not that we have so little time but that we lose so much...the life we receive is not short but we make it so; we are not ill provided but use what we have wastefully. -- Seneca, On the Shortness of Life
I'll weigh in (pun intended). I went for medical intervention not because it was "taking the easy way out" and I certainly wasn't "duped". The fact is, I could not get control of things on my own. It wasn't for a lack of effort, research, willpower or determination. If you can name a diet in the past 40 years, I was on it. They don't work long term. None of them. Not for me at least, and I don't know a single person that has had lifelong success while working a "fad" diet. The only way to maintain that I buy into, is a complete and total lifestyle change with a dedication to yourself, following a high-protein, low carb diet with plenty of water. That can be done without surgery, but for some, even that isn't sustainable without the help and support of a forum such as this. Fasting or other gimmick diet, or something like WLS, it all boils down to a dedication to a lifestyle change in your head. Without that, nothing will work because humans are a creature of habit by nature. Surgical intervention is only one tool, nothing more. It isn't a magic bullet, it is an aide for those that choose. That choice doesn't make them weak, or desperate; it doesn't make them wrong or foolish for choosing it. They certainly aren't "stupid" any more than WLS is a stupid option. I have an I.Q of 186, averaged out over 3 professionally administered tests (not those internet ones). Am I stupid for seeking help? I think not. I believe that people who admit they need help for something, then seek any measure they can to get that help and improve themselves, are to be commended. Indeed, in the world of weight loss, the same can be said for those that are genetically blessed, physically and mentally able and find the path to a healthy life without medical intervention deserve the exact same commendation, because in the end, they found the same success.
As I've posted before, in early 2013 I was 391 pounds. Through hard work on my dietary choices, discipline around food, and 4 nights a week at the gym, I dropped to around 330 in 6 months. Then it plateaued. With no explanation by my trainer friends, it wouldn't budge, no matter what I did. I tried multiple approaches, including the fasting method, alternating days for months on end. I never cheated, not once. For me, it didn't work. I didn't have a net loss after almost 3 years of trying. My bloodwork was the only thing that had improved slightly, moving my cholesterol in the right direction because of the regular physical activity and better foods. There I was, sitting at 330-340 in that window.
I asked my doctor about WLS and he set up a referral at my request after a lengthy conversation. We spoke for the better part of 1.5 hours, which is time that doctors don't usually have for patients these days. The Bariatric Clinic didn't seek me beyond my doctor's referral. They offered a chair on an intro class, and presented their information, believe it or not, in a matter-of-fact, non-biased way. They were clear that it isn't for everyone, and it was always my choice to follow through or not. I sought knowledge to see if this was the best option for me. During the extensive classes, I was able to pinpoint psychological and emotional triggers for me, and resolve those issues prior to any decision on surgery. WLS or not, identifying those issues and using tools other than food to eliminate them is most important for any success. I went through the battery of tests, all of the classes with the dieticians and psychologists, clinic doctor assigned to me, and read EXTENSIVELY on line about the post-surgical life. Based on my life experiences with every non-surgical option known to man, I made a VERY informed decision to accept their offer of surgery. The lifestyle change I mentioned before would have had to happen regardless, but the WLS I chose, has resulted in fast, effective weight loss which has helped me implement all of the other things required to achieve and maintain a healthy life moving forward.
Like Grim said, I wish you all the best as you maintain your opinions on WLS and proceed with your life as you see fit. Good luck to you, I really mean that.
Some people are gonna hate me for this .. but grrrl can you rock a cute bikini like many of us do post op? Do you run 5 Ks do yoga classes and horseback riding and live the rich full lives we have discovered after successful WLS?
I hate to see you expend your precious life energy on arguing with people who truly care about you because we're so similar .. and we all hate seeing our fellow MO sufferers fail diets and other powerless programs.
I at least desperately needed the surgery both both for my health and my self esteem. The surgery totally changed my health my outlook and my future. ((( ))) hugs
always wishing you the best
Hi and thank you so much! Any information you have I would love to have. U can send it to my email which is [email protected] or you can add me on Facebook, just look up Emelinoa Davis. Any information would be greatly appreciated! Thank u so very much!!
on 1/24/18 10:37 am
May be you should try HCG diet. it is one of the most successful diet for weight loss aspirants. My mom lost 90Lbs in 5 months using this diet. This diet consists of 4 phases. You can get some information from here on each phase. Make sure you need to use diet drops to control your hunger. Else its impossible to be in 500 calorie diet protocol. I still remember this site where i bought hcg drops for my Mom. These drops controls your appetite. Feel free to question anything related to this diet. I have lot of information..
Thank you.
Lol!! This is such a non-debate because any MO person with a brain will BEG BORROW STEAL to get WLS of whatever stripe after half a life wasted struggling with serious unsolvable with traditional remedies ( diet and exercise and " self discipline" ) weight and health issues.
Youre either a troll or totally misguided and honestly I really don't care which . When you get tired of your " 600 lb life " come back.. or not
I am 12 weeks out from my VSG. I was doing fine on about 600 calories per day and losing slowly but consistently (down 39 lbs****il this past week. 600 calories is just not keeping me full any longer. I am still eating almost exclusively protein, but find I am hungry between meals now and by dinner time, I am ravenous. My next appointment with my nutritionist is not until mid March, so I am wondering if I should increase my calories to 800-900 at this point. I don't want to stop losing, but I am worried because my appetite is BACK!
Typical day:
B: 1 egg with 1 oz meat and 1 oz cheese (or guac).
Sx2: 1 oz chicken or pork jerky or half container Oikos triple zero
L: 3 oz protein like grilled chicken - or - tuna salad w/parmesan crisps - or - 3 oz tilapia filet
D: Depends on what I am making for the family, modified for my diet.
E: Walking 8,000-10,000 steps or treadmill with some weights.
Hey I am the one. Don't know about others. I didn't do any kind of surgery yet. lol
uwe0306 · 3 replies · 231 views
