Profect vs. New Whey protien bullets

Now that we have a nutritionist looking at the posts (yea!!!), I am reporting this.  Are these both the same, as in do they have the same protein, or is one better than the other?  I am 8 months out and have been losing my hair for the past month.  Since it is so far from my surgery date, I figure it's my protein level.  Therefore, I have been taking a New Whey Bullet every day to supplement (42 gr. half in the morning and half at night).  I am still losing but I figure it will take some time to catch up.  Also, I have been taking Centrum vitamins but may switch to some children's chewables.  (My office mate who had this surgery in October takes Flintstone chewables.)  Are these sufficient in nutrients if you take them several times a day? Thanks! Fran

I would suggest that the dietitian explain PDCAAS protein scoring, and its value in judge the protein and nutritional value of a protein source.   This approach is supported by the World Health Organization, the Food and Drug Administration, and the Institute of Medicine at the National Academy of Sciences. We sent a sample of each of those two products, Profect and New Whey, to Covance Laboratories to assay their amino acid profile.  We then calculated their PDCAAS protein score to be either 5 or 6, out of a possible 100.   In contrast, most meats, egg and whey protein score 100. You can read our paper on this at this URL: http://www.unjury.com/unjury-update-may-2007.pdf Kind regards Jerome UNJURY Protein

I cannot tolerate Unjury, think it is the soy protein I do not tolerate, period, so have used New Whey vials almost exclusively for the first three months since my RNY.  Not only that, but the vials have been 80% or more of my daily protein. My recent lab tests came out MORE THAN PERFECT as far as proteins go!!!!  Personally, I think that Unjury does harm to itself by "dissing" the competition. Soley MYopinion on the matter. It will be interesting to see what the nutritionalist says. Linda

I would like to hear what the dieticians say about these vs. an Unjury rep.  That article pretty much boosts the Unjury product only!!  I want to hear this from someone who has actually comapred these products and others and has an objective oint of view on these.  I am also trying to fnd a good protein relacement, that doesn't require a lot of volume.  Thats why these bullets/protein seemed to be alluring me, since there are only 3oz.  Any advice anyone?

Yikes!  I almost hate to be the one to jump in here. Let me first preface my discussion by saying that as soon as I think I know all of the protein supplements out there - 25 more will hit the market!  It is an unbelieveably huge segment of the supplement world! Ok - I came prepared to discuss the PDCAA score. Proteins are not all created equal.  Our bodies are able to manufacture proteins by joining together amino acids.  There are some amino acids which our bodies can make, these are called 'dispensible' (or formerly non-essential) amino acids.  There are other amino acids which our bodies cannot make and we must obtain from our food (or another outside source), these amino acids are called 'indispensible' (or formerly essential) amino acids.  There is one more category of amino acids, and those are 'conditionally indispensible' - these become "essential" during certain disease states or physiological stress. (we will ignore these today) One of the ways we judge the quality of a protein is on the amino acid profile - if a food or protein source has all of the indispensible amino acids (IAAs) then it is considered a high quality (or high biologic value) protein.  So, proteins are judged by the completeness of their amino acid profile.  Protein from animal sources such as meat or milk are generally complete.  Proteins from collagen (the connective tissue of animals) is naturally low in all 9 IAAs. In former times, we compared proteins to a known reference protein (egg whites) to judge its profile.  Then someone got smart & said "hey, why aren't we looking at the absorbability of these proteins?"  So the scientists did.  Then in 1991 the Food & Agriculture Organization / World Health Organization proposed a superior method of assessing protein quality referred to as the Protein Digestibility Corrected Amino Acid Score (or PDCAAS) .  This score was adopted by the Institute of Medicine and tells you how well a particular protein will provide the IAAs required by humans. What makes the PDCAAS different is that it uses the most limited indespensible amino acid in the protein and uses that to reference the protein source.  In other words, you use the lowest score to calculate the value of the whole thing.  This is appropriate and a good way of judging the value of the supplement.  The fact is, if all of your protein is coming from a single, incomplete amino acid supplement, then your metabolism will be slowed until that indispensible amino acid is available.  It's like building a fence and you run out of nails - you may have plenty of wood, but you can't continue building until you get more nails. So if I'm going to cut to the chase... Most products with a Milk, Casein, Whey, Egg White, and Soy source will score 100% on the PDCAAS.  Most collagen-based supplements will score anywhere from 0 to 50%.  If your PDCAAS equals 50, then you would need to take 2 times the amount of that supplement to equal the effectiveness of a protein that scores 100.   Professionally, I recommend whey proteins as they are readily available and economical and good, complete sources of protein. PDCAAS 100 I also recognize that some people can't tolerate the usual protein supplements or they like the form of the other products (liquid vs. powder). In the world of food eating - we often eat incomplete AA foods.  The classic example is rice & beans.  Rice is lacking in one amino acid, beans are lacking in a different amino acid - if you eat the two together, you get a complete protein.  Research has also shown that these foods don't have to be eaten together, just the missing amino acid has to be made up for within about a day to maintain the rate of protein metabolisn. Back to WLS.  In my professional opinion, in the early days post-op it is very important that you get your protein in.  Some of that may be an incomplete protein.  One should also try to use complete proteins at another time in the day.  By the time you are eating food, you are making up for some of the incomplete supplements by taking in dairy foods, or fish, or another protein (like Wendy's chili - acoording to many of you...).  These foods will provide the limited amino acids and the deficiency in your supplement won't be so important.  Most important is still getting the protein in - however you can.  Sometimes this is very challenging. So my bottom line: Especially in the immediate post op period, a high quality protein from a milk, meat, egg, or soy source is important.  Once you are eating "real" food, the source of the protein supplement is not as critical.  Overall, using a complete protein is recommended . So what about those two products I would still need to read the labels and calculate the PDCAAS.  I will take the Unjury person's word for it that these products score low. So does that matter? Depends on where you are in the post-op world. Looks like there are people out there who do fine using these supplements (per the previous post) Hope this gets you all thinking! Danielle Halewijn RD eNutritioncare.com