whats the dif between starvation and satisfaction?

In Christa's beware post, it was touched upon about feeling starvation-like feelings while reducing caloric intake.  Somebody said she ate more volume now that she chooses healthy - i am SO in Kriz's camp where NO WAY am I eating less volume now that I eat healthier. Most days, I would starve all day til a mondo-sized supper happened. I do, most days, feel satisfied, way more so than when my calories were taken in during gigantic meals. One weird sensation I used to have pretty often after a huge freakin spaghetti supper with two pieces of dripping buttery garlic bread and two tall glasses of milk was...i swear to god i felt hungry almost immediately after eating such volume. These days, my goal is to eat nutrient dense items more often during the day. IF i can manage to eat a mondo supper, I feel so miserabel for like two days.  No WAY would I have those oft-felt hunger pangs that were completley out of place. For me, it demonstrates how eating healthier should ring your satiety bell, even though you eat WAAAAY less. What I was doing was starving my body for certain nutrients, namely fruits and veggies.  It was still crying even though i over fed it calorically speaking. Thoughts on this????

That thread really got to me.  I carried it around with me all day.  I guess I could relate to it a lot.  There have been so many times I have had an all or nothing mentality and would rather just not eat at all b/c it is too hard to deal with food and feeling hungry all the time anyway.  "starvation" is very common with anyone breaking an addictive behavior.  It's an emotional response.  I would get this way after a binge.  My brain would tell me that I was hungry.  It was like separation anxiety with food.  The worst I ever felt was this last time I started getting back on track.  I took a more structured approach which kept me from sneaking in things here and there and I felt it.  I was a mess for at least the first 4-5 days and I was completely emotional.  It was the 12 stages of grief over FOOD!  I look back on it and think it was insane but it was very real at the time.  I'm convinced my problem was to break my fast food habit. I kept asking myself why I was upset to work through it and I think I knew what was going on but just ignoring it.  Every time I felt something (stress, happiness, sadness, bitterness, etc) I would feed it.  Eventually it becomes pavlovian and food is expected any time an emotion is felt.  When a person like this does not feed that emotion panic can set in.  That is what was happening with me.  I still notice it when I eat a super satisfying meal.  When I get that little hunger pang right after I know exactly what it is and I have to get right back on track immediately.  It was one meal and I don't need any more right now.  I know that this part will probably be a lifelong battle for someone like me b/c I am addict.  It's really sad in some ways but at least I am caring for that self.

Beth,

You and I are like the same exact person. Seriously. lol. I have basically the same problems as you. Because I remember yesterday i was stressing out really bad while i was at work it was probably 2:30pm and i am like omg FOOD it will calm  me. I ended up eating an apple but in other cases I battle myself. Which it is extremely emotional and hard to do. Because I calm myself with food. And I have to talk my self out of it. Since I stressed yesterday I did eat more than I planned but I logged it all in and it wasnt that bad i was still under 1200 calories. So I was content with myself.

Everytime I have an emotion I have to make sure I dont feed it but I do go into panic mode because I feel the need to eat and if I dont I wont survive or something so I am trying to deal with that next. The fast food thing has calmed down a bit I probably eat it once a week now which is good for me. And if I do eat out I wil lget chicken or something small.

I think it all boils down to an addiction for most of us. Heck, even skinny people probably have an addiction. The difference is their bodies seem to be immune to the side affects whereas ours are not. I think nutritional balance is essential for fighting the addiction and feeling sated. In your case Neecee, I'm not sure you were ever really addicted to food. At least not in the same way I am. Your body probably really was craving the things you were depriving it. Mine probably is too, but it won't stop if I give it those things. If I were to fill my house with the foods that you eat I would still overeat. I'd go back to the kitchen after 2 plates of dinner and look for something sweet.  I'm addicted to the taste, the texture, the smell and the full or overstuffed feeling in my stomach.  I eat way past the point of enjoying the taste until my belly feels completely stuffed and then I shove more in for good measure.  Why...I have no clue.  boredom contributes..but I don't think that's the reason.   So here's my keys to success. I know that these things will work.. i just don't seem to follow them 1. Balanced nutrient rich foods.  (1200-1800 calories) 2. Water, water, water!  Rare sugar-free/diet beverage. Never anything full flavored .. 3. Exercise to burn a minimum of 500 calories a day.  (30 mins to 1 hour) 4. Mental counseling, psychologist, etc. 5. Group support, or support partner. Combine all 5 of those for the rest of your life and you're sure to lose and maintain..  I've done all of them except #4. Never have I done all of them at the same time.  Maybe that's why I fail... who knows..  i'm just trudging through the battle like everyone else.. just trying to find me way.. I think #4 may be a break through. I know that 90% of this is mental.. Just need help sorting it all out.

Hi Chris, I had to hijack this post and tell you I know exactly what you are talking about.  I have a son, he's 15 and 5'8" and weighs 285.  Obviously, as everyone knows, my house is rather boring.  We don't have junk food or anything fun in the house at all.  However, he still can't lose weight because he eats large amounts of even the good stuff and he seems to eat all the time, never getting full.  I have tried to explain to him calories and intake versus output but all he does is get angry.  I explained to him the other day that his after dinner (1 hour after dinner) "snack" of a triple decker peanut butter and jelly sandwich totaled 750 calories, and that was being kind.

I try to remember my roots and how difficult it was for me for a long time, and how many years I spent SMO.  But I love him and don't want to see him totally uncomfortable all the time.

All you can do is inform him.  You know yourself that you wouldn't and didn't change your ways until your own light bulb came on. It'll be the same way for him.  Right now, he's young an invincible (so he thinks). Not to mention he's 15 and the overeating is probably a form of rebellion.  If only we knew at 15 what we know now huh? 

In your case Neecee, I'm not sure you were ever really addicted to food. At least not in the same way I am. OHHHHHH, if you coulda seen me THEN, Kriz. I was sad, so very sad. I sometimes think if there had been a hidden camera what secrets it would have unleashed. In fact - this is not a bad mental picture exercise - would any of us like a camera on us while we were eating...or worse...eating alone????? perish the thought! For years...I was you, xactly. EVERY night...not sometimes, every stinking one, I would get up at some point after supper and cruise. If I was out for any reason, there would be a fast food stop or a giant candy bar stuffed in my mouth, all evidence disappeared before I got home.  I would get angry, but it did not stop me. I'd sit there, stuffing my face...like an animal. Then would come the guilt and shame and sefl hatred and beratement. For me, it led to purging. being alone in filthy public bathrooms trying to vomit.  Or in my one at home praying no body woudl know what I was doing. or exercising for hours tryin to undo what damage I had invoked. It's only obvious to those reading this that it was not about the food...obviously i was a person in pain. To me, at the time, not so much.  I had no idea how to stop this. It took me years of OA - as I said, I went literally 4x a week to lunch meetings or night meetings.  I was in crisis. I could not stop that sick behavior on my own and by the time I sought OA, I was VERY ready to admit that.  I aslo read everything I could get my hands on about binge-purge...found out how clinic treat people like me. A balanced diet of meats, grains, veggies and fruits every meal.  Who knew?  As I say, it sloooowly sunk in that my body was crying for nutrients, but I was too busy overstuffing with just anything for my mind/body/spirit to notice. It feels like I was literally another person. I had to re-teach myself.

You can do this. Maybe you do need help...only you can say that.

 

 

I'm the one who is eating more:) Of course I am drinking a lot less coffee which substituted for many breakfasts and snacks. Old eating plan looked like this... between 6 am and noon 6 cups of coffee with half and half and sugar (lots of calories there to be sure) lunch 1/2 Cup mac n cheese and 2 chicken strips from the Safeway deli between 1 pm and 6 pm another 3 or 4 cups of coffee and a handful of m&m's dinner might be a fried chicken breast, 3/4 C of mash with butter and some coleslaw.   1**** cream for dessert . I didnt really eat a TON of food...  I eat WAY more now - mostly because I am actually eating. I miss some foods, but because I have not eliminated them I know I can have them if I want too.  I just have to plan ahead to have them.  I dont feel physical hunger really at all and the mental hunger seems to pass pretty quickly for me.  Maybe this is because I have accepted the fact that this is a medical issue... a do or die issue for me.

and maybe I am just lucky - I quit smoking 9 years ago... just decided it was time to do it and quit.  Havent had a cigarette since.  I had made some half hearted attempts prior to that but without success.  But when I decided that I needed to do it for me  - well I just did it.

And this time round I've decided that i  need to do this once and for all- and it feels similar.

I know that when I avoid eating breakfast or skip any meal, I feel accomplished - like I beat the "beast" (hunger).  Even if I skipped that mean to have a 1000 calorie food fest for dinner, I still felt like I had won.  And that is such a wrong way to feel. 

I'm definitely an all or nothing girl too, just like Christa, and I feel like if I'm going to diet, I'm going to starve myself silly and reap 100% benefits, or stuff myself like a teddy from Build-A-Bear.

Unfortunately, even though I'm 6 months out from my surgery (can you believe it's been that long already??) I am still not eating "properly".  I'm not making healthy choices every time I could be.  Last night I had taco bell for dinner when I could have had chicken and broccoli, chinese style and had a healthier dinner.  I'm far from perfect in that regard.  But I am trying to keep smarter snacks around (like Kashi and protein bars) and avoiding chocolate and ice cream all together.

Quantity over Calories definitely wins.  Having 4 cups of carrot sticks with some low fat dressing is going to beat the 1 white castle mini burger.  I just wish I could act on what I know. 

(siiiiigh) Just another reason why I'm not losing the weight I should be.

Perhaps its easier like this:   4 heaping cup full of yummmmy, crunchy, delightfully filling, delectable carrots with delicious low fat dressing that is going to dance with my tongue as rain pours from my salivary glands! or a miniature, greasy, mushy,  salty, putrid white castle burger thats going to stick to my teeth and leave a horrible pasty aftertaste in my mouth at which my taste buds will shrivel up and die!