What Neecee said....and more

Neecee, In response to Ken's post Neecee posted something about Ken Spurlock and how after his experiment with McDonalds he was more prone to "gain" after a heavy weekend of eating. I have long contended that the idea of the average person needing to consume and absorb 3500 calories in order to gain a pound, can not apply to those of us who are or have been MO.  I think this even more strongly when a post-op WLS person gains weight.  Wouldn't it be impossible for them to truly eat that much considering their digestive systems, much less the size of their stomachs? I do think we rely far too heavily on the scale to gauge our successes or failures.  But when we DO go "off" our change of life plans we hardly go off like "normal" people do.  For me going off means eating too many granola bars, not scarfing down on Cinnabons.  I guess this is a frustrating area for me and can't truly understand how our, particularly my, body works.  I have long wanted to go to someone that can explain what I need to do, forever, and how to do it.  Just when I think I have it down pat something gets in the way of me truly understanding it. This weekend in particular.  I wake up on Sunday morning, step on the scale and VOILA I "gained" 6 pounds.  WTH???  I had worked out on Saturday morning for my first time since my operation and I guess my muscles were holding on to a heck of a lot of water.  Through the course of the day I had drank perhaps 130 ounces of water, and when I went to the bathroom I barely tinkled.  I knew my body was holding onto water, WHY step on the scale?? So I proceeded to drin****il I almost drowned and in the next 3 hours I "lost" 6 pounds.  Yeah, right. So the scale is a mistake at times like this.  But what happens when the gain comes, we KNOW we did nothing to earn it, and it still disappoints us? I guess perhaps the point of this post?? Do I have one?? I guess its to say that we aren't "normal" as much as we've tried to make ourselves so.  I think we've done irreparable damage to our bodies that may never be explained enough for us to understand.  So when we binge our binges might net us an 11 pound weight gain, while a friend who eats the same stuff may not gain an ounce.  I wish I were the friend!!!

donna - this is exactly what that whole long posting i was involved with that week was talking about. we are different. it is not a simple math equation - as much as we would like it be. the bodies of people who have  WLS have adapting to living on 700-800 cals a day, so when they begin eating 1600-1800, which is more than normal for the average person, they gain weight. bodies adapt and i firmly believe that, try as we might, we will never know REALLY exactly how the body works.

Andrea, I believe that as well, we'll never know.  I think this makes it even more apparent that this IS a way of life, and changing the way we look at food and react to it HAS to be the only way that we survive in the long term.  Both you and I, and many others here, have figured it out enough to lose hundreds of pounds.  I know what I need to do, and that is keep on doing what I've been doing.  It just frustrates me that the guilt I will feel over "cheating" will be rewarded with a gain.  I just want to feel normal, whatever the heck that means.

The scale is a cruel mistress, to be sure. It provides terrific instant gratification and affirmation when the numbers go your way-- but when they don't, it's easy to succumb to "What's the point?" kinda thinking, and it does take the wind out of your sails. I've started only caring about the losses, and tossing small gains into the wind. Nothing you can do about them-- it simply happens. Water, time of month, exercise, illness-- any and all of those things can cause you to hold a pound or two.

If you watch over time, you do start to see the cyclical nature of it all, I am told. A trusted doctor I know tells me, "Weigh every single day or very infrequently-- any other way lies madness"...his theory is that if you weigh infrequently you will only see the losses, and every day you will come to understand the cycles and the relatively meaningless mini-gains. So what do I do? Well, I weigh every other day or so when I am at the swim club-- the scale there is reliable. And-- of course--- doing makes me nutty as hell.

Shari, Bingo again.  It's just nice seeing another intelligent human being echo what I already know to be true, yet fail time and time again to embrace long enough to stop questioning the process!!! I see the cyclical nature of my weight loss after almost 2 years of working it.  I am one that hangs onto weight like a feind and then dumps it on one fell swoop.  THEN I get back on the scale the next day and the spiral begins.  I am better off weighing every 2 weeks instead of once a week and realizing that is how my body works.  But, do I do that? Noooooooooooooooooooooooooo.  I need a lobotomy!!! I have come to realize that when I don't weigh I am trying to avoid the scale, which means I've been "bad" whatever the heck that means.  If I am getting on the scale I feel like I've been "good" and therefore I'm entitled to a loss, dammit!!!!  I don't take into consideration what I've already conceded is true, my weight loss cycle.

I agree that by far the most frustrating part of losing weight are the daily fluctuations when you weigh in on a daily or semi daily basis.  That's why I think it's counterproductive in many cases to weigh in daily unless you are using a tool to trend your weight loss and get an indication of your actual weight loss versus what the scale is telling you each day.  Your body processes as much as 11 pounds of water per day.  Take a look at this link, particularly the image shown describing research by NASA about the input/output of the typical person each day: http://www.fourmilab.ch/hackdiet/www/subsection1_2_2_0_6.htm l#SECTION0220600000000000000 I quote, "...most of the changes in weight you see from day to day on a scale reflect nothing more than how much water is in the rubber bag at the moment." Keep that in mind when you choose to weigh in on a daily or semi daily basis.

Wow Bert, That is both depressing and concise. I don't know which more I feel right now, educated or ready to kill myself. LOL

Donna..you get where I come from exactly.  The fatal error was to become MO. After that, those freakin bmi/r calculators are OUT the door.  Yes, it is not like I sneak out to McD's - EVER.  I don't eat BAGS of chips or whole cakes. We're talkin one too many 100 cal snack bags or two.  Only I and my DH truly get how dedicated I am to exercise, I don't care who beleives me here.  I should NOT be this fat all things considered. Nor should you. We are now on our own set of rules.

Exactly Neecee, which is why I said to Andrea that we just need to keep on working what worked and make it  a forever thing. All these calculators and BMR and BMI and crap really stand for nothing at all.  This is very frustrating!!!  But it is a reality.  A sad one, and yes we did it to ourselves.  Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr I just wish the desire to be normal would leave me as well. I just wish that I could in fact drive through McDonalds (if I could possibly stand the food) and eat a "bad" meal with out either gaining 10 pounds or beating the crap out of myself.  I think I could live with the weight, only if I could live with the guilt. But I'm preaching to the choir here, aren't I?  LOL That's what I love about this place.

its funny you should say that. one of the major things i had to "get over" mentally before my weight would start coming off was accepting that very fact. accepting that i will never be normal. i will never be a size 6. i will never be able to eat whatever i want and not pay the consequences. and it is not fair. and i was very angry about that. looking back on my teenagerhood/young adult years, i was a really angry person and not for any *real* reason. but this was one of the things. getting over and accepting the unfairness of it all. these are the genetic cards i've been dealt so i can choose to play with them the way i want or just not play the game and keep gaining weight and stay bitter and unhealthy and lonely. i don't even remember what changed really but it was palpable and it wasn't until then that i started losing weight (even though i'd been at duke for weeks - i hadn't lost any real weight. very weird that mind/body connection).