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old habits die hard

SteveS
on 5/6/08 9:07 am - Dayton, OH
Hey guys, I am 17 weeks out from my surgery and I am getting close to 100 lbs gone from my highest and nearly 80 lbs since surgery 17 a little over 4 months ago (lost 20 lbs preop liquid diet).  Went tot he store today and bought some 38 waist shorts.  Damn that was a good feeling.  I have not been a 38 for a long time.  Anyway, I am noticing that I am wanting to eat for the wrong reasons.  I know that it is the old me coming through emotional eating, self medicating whateer you want to call it.  How do you get through it?  I don't want to sound like a sissy but I have been having a hard time emotionally lately.  My wife says I have been cranky, short, and depressed since surgery.  I kinda agree with her.  I am not taking any happy pills although tried some Cuervo Gold last night and wow it hits you quick.  Any advice or info would be most appreciated. Thanks, Steve 304+ highest 284 day of surgery 208 today
Brian I.
on 5/6/08 9:56 am
Has your protein intake gone down. I know I get like that when I let my protein levels/intake drop. I definitely know how you feel, even at my stage I have similar feelings sometimes.

Btw, how tall are you. I'm just curious because I'm at 245 but I can fit comfortably in a size 38 shorts/pants. Interesting...
Chuck N.
on 5/6/08 11:42 am - Salt Lake City, UT
My first piece of advice would be to give yourself permission to be struggling emotionally and psychologically with this process.  Everyone struggles to some degree or other, and some of us have a much harder time than others do.  Unfortunately this isn't talked about a lot in the Weight Loss community (have NO idea why it isn't emphasized more.........). Be very careful with the alcohol - many post-ops transfer addictions and many end up with alcohol issues.   I have had my own issues with vodka in my year post-op, and finally went to therapy to deal with the psychological issues that were coming up as I was losing weight.    Hang in there man - and, know that what you're experiencing is actually VERY COMMON post-op.   Thanks for having the courage to share your story on here.   Just because our body starts to shrink, doesn't mean we magically develop coping skills that we never had before surgery.   I was a mess when my surgeon took away my ability to BINGE EAT my problems away.......     Feel free to email me if you want to chat more about this... Chuck
Dx E
on 5/6/08 10:40 pm - Northern, MS

Steve, It could be for a number of reasons.
All of them “fixable.”

First,
If like most Obese people,
You’ve used food in the past to comfort and calm
Your mood when stressed.
That’s gone.
You’ll want to work to find other tools
And tactics for dealing with stress.

Second,
Could be a symptom of Post-Surgical Depression. VERY Common.
Even for folks who have non-Weight-loss surgery
There is a VERY High incidence of Post-Surgical Depression.
One of the biggest symptoms is irritability and extreme changes in mood.
Couple that with the first reason
And you’ve got a recipe for a dam grumpy fat man
Getting smaller and thinner yet more upset each day.

Third,
Could be a change in testosterone levels.
But I’d say “change” rather than “raised” testosterone levels.
“…some of the emotional issues can be from extra testosterone
That is being released from the fat tissues as you drop the weight.”
Very true. But, a dietary intake that greatly reduces your fat intake
(like 3 or 4 months on minimal calories and lower fat intake?)
Will cause Testosterone levels to drop.
Big fluctuations in testosterone levels is most likely,
Or just Low Testosterone levels could be the culprit as well.

A common sign of low testosterone is a change in mood and behavior.
You find it very easy to get angry at trivial incidents.
Things you used to enjoy now seem like chores.

When men who cannot produce testosterone
Come off hormone replacement therapy,
They become irritable and depressed.
Their mood improves when they resume treatment.
In fact, some researchers think that low testosterone levels
Are one reason why some men become grumpy,
Nervous and irritable as they age. (grumpy old men for a reason)
Stress can also cause men of any age to experience a drop in testosterone levels.
The reason is that certain regions of your brain
Are "loaded" with receptors for testosterone.
In fact, men with depression have free testosterone levels
Almost 20% lower than normal.
(according to Drs. Von Muhlen, & Kritz-Silverstein
In the Rancho/Bernardo Study.
Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and Metabolism.)

In contrast, high levels of testosterone typically lift your mood,
And give you a feeling of well-being,
Even though they tend to make you more aggressive/assertive.

Most likely, it’s all of this at once.
Testosterone fluctuations from Highs to lows,
Coupled with a touch of Post-Surgical Depression
And stressing you out in the absence of your old stand-by
Stress reliever- Food.
Yes?
And then even add on top of it that you
Were one of the guys lucky enough to have a Leak?
Hell, it’s a miracle you haven’t been out killing the neighbors!
So, what to do?
Well explain to the missus that you are having “Your Period!”
And it’s going to last a while.
“Bear with me, I’m PMS-ing for my first time!
And it's a really bad one!”
Seriously, do enlist your family to Help you through this difficult time
And ask them to bear with you and understand.
That's very important that they become part of the solution.

Also, and equally important-
Call the Doc and say-
“I’m having some post-surgical depression!”

If a person exhibits one or more of the following symptoms
It can be a sign of depression-

1. Exhaustion on waking
2. Disrupted sleep, sometimes through upsetting dreams
3. Early morning waking and difficulty getting back to sleep
4. Doing less of what they used to enjoy
5. Difficulty concentrating during the day
6. Improved energy as the day goes on
7. Anxious worrying and intrusive upsetting thoughts
8. Becoming emotional or upset for no particular reason
9. Shortness of temper, or irritability

A quick way to get a fairly accurate rating is-
The Goldberg Depression Questionnaire
At-
http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?id=973&type=doc&cn=Depression%20(Unipolar)

Many Bariatric Doctors routinely put their patients on an anti-depressant
For the first 3 months Post-Op as just standard practice.

Your brain just took a bath in some serious drugs for anesthesia.
Probably in the neck surgery as well as the Bypass.
That tends to throw off even the most stable of brain chemistries.
Add all the other stuff to it and BAM!

Call the Doc.
I was on Effexor for the first 6 months,
And it certainly made dealing with
Being “One of the Complication statistics”
A hell of a lot easier to deal with.

Stay on top of this.
Don’t just “Shake it off like a man!”
That’s what makes men “go postal” or get in trouble.
Don’t let any old prejudices about Psyche-Docs or treatment
Get in the way.
If you had a kidney problem you’d go to the kidney Dr. Right?
Well, this is a mood problem. Call your regular Doc, Your Surgeon,
(they can both call in a prescription, and often will)
Or even a “Mood Dr.” and Get-Er-Done!

"I am not taking any happy pills although tried some Cuervo Gold ..." That approach to self-medicating, Has screwed some guys up big time. Avoid it.

 

Post-Op Depression is Super Common. Depression and Obesity are very “Chicken & Egg.” Depressed because you are Obese? Or- Obese due to the Depression? Doesn’t actually matter. The short of it is, No matter how we view ourselves, Mood is the result of brain chemistry. When we are sad, chemical neurotransmitters are released When we are happy, the same. And fearful, and stressed, etc, etc... Big Ole Bio-Chem Stew going on. It is the result of how we are stimulated And it is the cause of how we respond to stimulation. A year of talking through, working through emotional issues Will result in slow incremental brain chemistry changes, And we will begin responding to stimulation differently And our outlook and general mood can be raised. Or, Cut to the chase, Take a pill that does the same thing in a couple of weeks. I believe in “Better Living Through Chemistry.” Same with gardening. 2 approaches- I could slowly work the soil and remove insects manually And allow plant matter to de-compose into the soil To make it richer, Or, I can throw in a little MiracleGrow and spray with pesticide. Which of the two makes sense? Call a Psychiatrist, share with them the numbers from the test score Explain “how you feel,” And he’ll hook you up with something To re-set your brain chemistry levels. Don’t resist because of Psyche-Doctor Stigma. If you had pain in your knee, you wouldn’t think twice about Taking something for it. So, pain in your Psyche? Same thing. Call the Doc. Get ‘er Done! No extra Points for just suffering in silence. Many people deal with anti-depression meds right through WLS Without it getting in the way of the surgery at all. If you need to mix a little vacation with the meds? Go For it. Be pro-active and get this fixed. You will be amazed at how much better the world is. Other “non-Med” things that will help? More Sunlight (release of hormones that help better, more restful/productive sleep) More Exercise, (elevates the mood through naturally adjusting neurotransmitters) More Laughter, (see funny movies and comedians, Laughter IS great for the psyche ) More Sex! (just a good thing always, like laughter and exercise in the Sun times 10) Life is Meant to be LIVED! Not Endured!

 

Hope you’re feeling level and happier soon!

Best Wishes-
Dx

 

 

 Capricious;  Impulsive,  Semi-Predictable       

SteveS
on 5/7/08 12:59 am - Dayton, OH
Thanks for the responses guys.  I did not think that a post op depression would last or even be as strong a factor as it has.  Dx, I really appreciate your thoughts on this.  I am going to call my Doc and see what he says.  Thanks again. Steve
carbonblob
on 5/7/08 3:51 am - los angeles, CA
yeah, what chucknuts and Dx said! seriously, it's a phase but one you have to get over. we all go through it. it's only been 17 weeks. you'll be going through a ton of changes in the next couple years. so sit back and ride. try not to get too hung up on any single problem. believe me, things will change. i went through head hunger, actual hunger and no hunger over the past two years. our bodies will be changing as time goes on. you just have to get your head around it. so i say keep coming here and post. read and soak. that's the next step.....carbonblob
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