Raw Food Diet / Vegan

Hey guys, Recently most of my family is moving more and more towards organic, raw / vegan diets. I'm wondering if anyone here has posted literature / guidance on the pros and cons of a WLS person becoming a "Raw" practioner?  I'm 15 months out, feel great, lost a 100 lbs and am maintaining a good solid 155 by lots of workouts, walking etc.  Take all of my supplements and vitamins everyday and otherwise loving life. Any downside that you guys have heard about relating to Raw diets? Thanks, R

Hey Rick   One thing I have always wondered is were do ya get your pro from . Other then that , I have not heard any thing bad about the raw diet .  Sounds to me like it would be quit good for ya .   I would miss the meat, MYSELF Let us know how that works for you .                   Nick

I'm told, lots of avocado, then some fish (I don't think I could do 100%), more likely 80/20, where I do a very good raw breakfast, lunch, snack etc., then 2-3 times a week, a piece of fish or something.  I still like the ISO Pure - although they say the "whey" is not raw...but.  I'm going to study it a little more and next week, talk to the surgeon support staff and see what they say.  But it does sound good! Too many years of lovin' a good filet mignon - that'll be hard to give up. Thanks, R

I'm not too concerned about the vegetarian aspect of this proposed diet.  I'm not as far out as you, but I'm effectively eating like a vegetarian (not vegan) almost every day, except for the occasional foray into fish, chicken, or very very rarely, a small amount of red meat.  I just concentrate on getting 70-90 grams of protein a day from all my sources. Note that strict "veganism" proscribes eating any foods that are "animal derived".  That means no eggs, no dairy (no milk, cheese, etc.).  Can you obtain all the complete protein that your body (especially a post-WLS body) requires?  I really have to wonder.  Even if you can eat a variety of complementary vegetable proteins, most vegetable sources are NOT nutrient dense, and especially not protein dense.  Someone who hasn't had WLS surgery can probably compensate somewhat by simply eating more of everything.  But you're no longer one of these people.  You'd better start liking soy derivatives like soy milk, tofu and tempeh!  Faux soy filet mignon, anyone?  (Then there's the issue of these soy-based foods possibly not being considered "raw"!  I don't know...  Man cannot life on raw soybeans alone.  Only pigs can.  ) I hope you're still intending to take all your post-WLS nutritional supplements, including multivitamins, calcium and iron.  If you don't, you're setting yourself up for a nasty fall. Avocado should be considered a fat, not a fruit or vegetable.  It's all good heart-healthy fat, but it's still fat, and its high calorie count relative to its other nutrients should be taken into account. Any claim that "raw" foods are intrinsically better than cooked is a statement of religious faith, and not of nutritional science.  There's nothing the matter with raw vegetables, but the bit about "enzymes" and "eating live food" is a lot of nonsense.  Plus, by limiting your diet to items that are "raw", you're going to need to be careful not to end up with nutritional deficiencies.  Raw foods are even less nutrient dense than cooked foods, and many of the nutrients in raw foods are inaccessible to human digestion, locked within cell walls which are broken open only after adequate cooking.  Cows eat "raw" grass and dried hay, but they also have a ruminant stomach full of bacteria which break down cellulose and turn it into useful carbs. /Steve

I know a vegan family that lives 3 doors down from me.  The wife is the enforcer, weighs in at about 102. The 8 year old daughter, goes about 42 lbs (can't have bday cake at my daugters parties).  The father sneeks up to my cookouts for steak scraps and beer.   I would think that you could get by with Tofu for protein, and misc nuts and stuff.  But it was my understanding that vegans don't eat fish. There is probably enough varity to get by in the WLS lifestyle.  Good luck to you if you choose to try.  Keep everyone in the loop. Guy

Paul, Steve and Guy - Many thanks for your replies.  I'll take them all in consideration - and approach this with some modification.  It is a lifestyle, and a lot will depend on what my surgeon and PCP say next week.  I think a moderate balance is the way to go - I guess you can be "vegan and not raw" but can't be "raw and not vegan".. Thanks again for the input, really appreciate it. Rick p.s., Guy, if you see a 155 lb French/Irishman sneaking into the yard for a couple of scraps of steak, it'll be one of your WLS buddies.. :)

> I guess you can be "vegan and not raw" Yep. > but can't be "raw and not vegan".. Unless raw meat is allowed on a "raw" diet!  :-)  Steak tartare, anyone? One of the potential problems with veganism is that non-animal-derived products do not contain vitamin B12.  B12 supplementation is usually recommended to anyone considering a vegan "lifestyle".  This is one of the few times that having had WLS works in your favor; because most of us (esp. RNYers) can't absorb B12 well, we've already been taking megadoses of B12 sublingually or by monthly injections.  If you're already taking B12 supplements, that's one fewer issue about veganism to worry about. /Steve

Honestly unless you plan to drink whey protein shakes, or eat lots of fish.... I'd say no it's not a good idea. It was already said that veg. protein is not complete...nor does it have enough B vits for a post op WLS patient.  during the RNY they remove most of your stomach and part of your intestines from the digestive process...this  compromises your bodies ability to digest and absorb protein.  Hence the reason that we as post ops need to eat EXTRA protein...... My suggestion is eat raw if you want...but do it drinking drink whey protein shakes . BTW i also agree that the whole raw concept is garbage....a lot of them (like the hallelljujah diet)  are based on the fact that "god gave adam and eve veggies only in the garden of eden and no meat...and that was his original intention" what they fail to mention was that God killed the first animals to cloth adam and eve from their sin...and it was God who gave man meat to eat post fall. Scott

I am married to a vegetarian. Quite a deal. She is tiny and eats twigs. I was a fat meat eater and had to have WLS. I do eat a lot of vegan foods with her now. Soy is amazing high in protein, so I eat things like Boca burgers and a product called Quorn, which is a fake chicken breast that has about 12g of protein in a serving. It doesn't taste like the real thing, but since I can barely eat anything anyway, why not? I have no guidance on the raw piece, but there are plenty of vegan ways to get your protein.