Creatine.

Do any of you guys currently take creatine? I have been hitting the gym for a while and havent seen crazy amount of muscle growth. I have been looking to it and if I increase my protein and implement creatine that I can pack on some nice lean muscle. Your thoughts? Bobby.

Creatine is pretty much the only workout supplement that I would say definitively works.  That and protein, but only if you aren't getting enough.  If you are already getting lots of protein, more protein is just calories.  The other stuff may or may not work, but it doesn't have the study-after-study backing of creatine, and I doubt anything has the dollar-to-benefit ratio of creatine. Creatine works by allowing your muscles to work longer, thus causing more fiber damage and more repair.  It doesn't do anything if you don't take advantage of that extra ability by lifting more (more reps or more weight).  Despite the popular culture, there is no need to cycle it (this is built around the steroids mentality).  It takes a few days to build up in your muscles before the benefits accrue.  We aren't talking a miracle supplement here, but you should see steady improvements with effort over 2-3 months. Don't be surprised if you gain a few pounds (or lose a few less than you expect) in the first few weeks after starting it.  Creatine makes your muscles hold water, an effect which may or may not be visible.  Similarly, you lose a few pounds the week after you quit taking it.

Ok a question to the supplement guru I see there is a lot of creatine out there....someone said they put a couple drops under the tongue....other site say, mic this crap up.....are they all the same....under the tongue sound good....which have you found that you like the best....and how do you take it....? I think I stalled out at 50 mins.....i do an hour hour 10 with the free weight, and then the cardio....but I get bored...not one to have the speakers in my ears....but I do think I put on a pound or 2....and it seems to show....I took some post op pics, that i'm willing to share, if you would like....send me an e-mail...geez man, the PS is a whole new world from the RNY....RNY was nothing.... hope all is well....as soon as we get some dry weather I'll send it to you...we are floating here in houston Russ

You'll hear lots of opinions on how to take creatine.  Some are influenced by superstition, steroid use, vitamin absorption theories, etc.  Also, supplement companies want to sell more of it now that it has become a brandless comodity, so they make mixes and try to get you to take huge doses.  All that said, here's what I do. First, I buy pure creatine monohydrate in powder form.  The pills are very expensive and unnecessary (it's absolutely flavorless, slightly chalky) and may even be harder to absorb.  The proprietary blends are mostly sugar and flavoring and give you little flexibility on how to take it. I take about 5 grams a day, which is a tad more than necessary, probably.  A smaller guy (say 160 pounds) would probably get the same benefit from 2-3 grams.  Some people do a loading phase of about 5 days where they take 15- 25 grams; that might give some marginal benefit.  If you do that, divide the doses to maximize absorption. Studies suggest you should take creatine with carbs to maximize absorption. I often mix mine in my fiber supplement (which has some sugar in it).  Sometimes I just put the spoon of powder right in my mouth and swi**** with some water, then eat a plum or nectarine.  Obviously, the carbs can be an issue for some RNY patients because of dumping.  If you ever make protein smoothies with fruit or other carbs in it, that would be a good option.  I usually take creatine right after working out on days when I lift or bike.  There are theories that suggest you should do it before, right after, and also that it doesn't matter.  You can google to see the various arguments, I found the post-workout argument most compelling (muscles will take it up best right after it has been depleted). 

Creatine seems to be proven safe and effective and should give you a few more reps on your current weight along with a nice pump. It's cheap, too. 

Whether or not you pack on muscle depends a lot on genetics, diet, amount of rest/sleep and any number of other factors. It's pretty hard to gain muscle while you are still losing weight, but most MO people already have considerable muscle, so you'll be doing good just to hang on to that. 

If you don't see results in a month or so, you might want to google "hard gainers". 

Good Luck,

Dave

Bob, Creatine is good for endurance and allowing you to work more to get there faster. Protein intake is necessary fro building muscle.  Most will advise 1 gm per pound of goal weight  body weight rather than the 60+ WLS recommends. Sound like you might want to consider glutimaine, which has claims wjen combined with branch chain amino acids (BCAAs) stimulate natural human growth hormone (HGH) production. The follwong I cut and pasted from Wikipedia:

Protein

Bodybuilders often take a powdered form of protein, the essential building blocks for muscle. Protein powder is generally consumed immediately after exercising, or in place of a meal. Having sufficient protein intake allows for efficient growth and repair of muscle tissue.

• Whey protein is the most commonly used type of protein. It contains high levels of all the essential amino acids not produced by the human body, and is absorbed by the body very quickly.
• Casein protein is the richest in glutamine, an amino acid that aids in recovery, and has casomorphin which helps the body to absorb the amino acids over a long time.
• Soy protein contains all essential amino acids, and is an alternative protein for vegetarians. However, soybeans contain a type of phytoestrogen called isoflavones which have a weak estrogenic activity ^[1].
• Egg white protein is a lactose- and dairy-free protein.

Glutamine

Glutamine is the most abundant amino acid found in human muscle and is supplemented because supplement manufacturers claim the body's natural glutamine levels are depleted during anaerobic exercise. It is argued that supplementation by bodybuilders may be required as deficiency may lead to a weakened immune system and wasting of muscle tissue. It is sold as a micronized, instantly soluble powder.

Branched chain amino acids

Amino acids are the building blocks of protein; the body breaks consumed protein into amino acids in the stomach and intestines. There are three branched chain amino acids (BCAAs): leucine, isoleucine, and valine. Each has numerous benefits on various biological processes in the body. Unlike other amino acids, BCAAs are metabolised in the muscle. BCAAs have an anabolic/anti-catabolic effect on the muscle. Might be worth a try to maximize natural muscle growth since protein intake and utilization is significant for us WLS post-opers. Joe