Weight Training Rep Execution Speed (?)

Hey Guys,

I've been grooving on the pro workouts that are all over Youtube - Just search the name of a bodybuilder or other pro athlete and you can see them working out, posing or whatever.

But...

Having once been a Nautilus (naughtylust?) instructor, I'm shocked at the form that I see. I only recently saw the movie "Pumping Iron" for the first time and both in that movie and the Youtube vids, the guys are jerking the weights around:

Arnie uses his lower back to execute deadlifts...

Franco jerks up the overhead press...

Lou (Ferrigno) dips his knees to get his dumbbell raises up (deltoids)

I was always taught that you raise the weight "to a slow count of two" and "let it down to a slow count of four".

Of course, "slinging the weights around" seems to have served the top pros well...

Does anyone have any information on slow and intense to isolate only the target muscle group, versus fast, slinging, bouncing movements, which use other muscle groups?

The only thing(s) I can figure out with this is maybe, they are trying to  combine a power lift with their regular training to get some explosive power out of the lift. Don't know (?!?).

Kind Regards,

Dave

 

Maybe it's a progress type thing.......it seems that just like science, the science of body building/working out has changed over the years.   I remember reading a book from the 50s about body building.  While some of the exercises are the same, the majority are not...the ones now are more specific...and the nutritional info is completely different.  Those clips were from the 70s?....perhaps more info about protection your lower back and such have come about since then....or perhaps they were just showing off for the camera. Scott

Lou Ferrigno's were mostly recent and he was slinging, but like you say, the poor form could be attempts to appear "dynamic" and powerful for the public.

Thanks,

Dave

Best information I've found is from Ellington Darden and Arthur Jones and the HIT method which has been discussed recently here.  The basic idea I came away with is "less is more" vs. the "more the better" philosophy so many people follow. My workouts were going well for me, but I got to the point where I was too thin or at least did not have the muscle mass I desired.  So I decided to try out some of Darden's suggestions which he bases primarily on the teachings of Arthur Jones who invented Nautilus.  The workouts were shorter, less repetitions/higher weights to failure each set and fewer workouts per week.  It highly stresses slower movement on the positive and negative side with great attention to form. Another thing that sparked my interest was the methods can be applied to free weights and Nautilus...I'm about 90% Nautilus (although this is going to change as I'm beginning to max out  some of the machines). Working out fewer times per week and putting in less time per workout worked wonders for me - it was super intense though and honestly I didn't get a great deal of enjoyment with it - I mean EVERY workout was a b*tch and there were times when I'd get a little nauseated and my eyes would be watering the burn was so much greater than I've ever experienced.  But, the end result was I leaned out - dropping body fat percentage significantly and added muscle mass and much improved definition which was lacking before.  And I can't believe the gains in strength...this is probably what convinced me on this strategy the most.  Surprising to me was with the added mass I did not gain weight although I look about 15 pounds heavier (muscle mass not fat). Weight training is mental therapy for me too and honestly I don't enjoy HIT - I dread it in fact even though it's effective for me.  So, I've compromised and altered my routine to about halfway in between HIT and the "more the better" method.   After a six week period of this I do two weeks of HIT and then back to my normal routine again.   Didn't tell you anything you didn't already know I'm sure, but wanted to share what's working for me. Cards Fan "STEP OFF THE SIDELINES AND GET IN THE GAME!"

Hi CF,

Having worked in a Nautilus, I can say that just about everyone maxes out after a few months on just one set of each machine in the circuit. Some people go back and do additional sets on certain machines, other people mix in freeweights, still others have a free weight day or go freeweight all together.

In my day (shortly after "Pumping Iron"), we would never allow anyone to jerk the weights around and I just assumed that most people were not, but evidently there is still a lot of that going on.

Closest thing I've tried to hit is this week's attempt to run 400's at about 70% effort and 100's at 90-100% effort before my morning deadlift workout and before my morning squat workout. This week, that was Monday and Wednesday mornings (Japan time). My upper thighs and calfs are really sore - I mean "can barely move them" sore. I want to get another sprint workout in this week, but common sense is telling me I'd better wait until Monday. Not sure if that's a hit workout, because the running part lasts about 30 minutes, but it sure is a killer, especially if you follow with a heavy compound weight exercise involving the lower body.

Best Wishes,

Dave

Hi Guys, A pretty good trainer I know admits that "jerking weights around" can result in strength gains and does allow for moving heavier weights. But . . . He also notes that good form--in the long run--requires more from more muscles (stabilizers, core, peripherals, etc.) AND good form is less likely to cause injuries (back, tendons, ligaments, muscle tears). Also, good form requires control, whether using lighter weights at higher reps and speed, or heavier weights at slower speeds. His advice: Use good form and mix up light-high-rep routines with heavier-low-rep ones and even throw in slooow light weight hig-reps, etc. A lot of the massive guys at my gym are "weight slingers" and they do move impressive weight, but most of them look bulky rather than cut and buff and often slouch and glower around the stacks. I guess part of the goal is INTIMIDATION! Oooo. I am having great results for a codger who's only been into serious weight training for about a year after 25 years or so of a sedentary, over-eating life. And the first part of that year was pre-surgery. Personally, I like the challenge of increasing my lifting limits without cheating. 'Course if I get really strong, I may become a slinger myself. Stay tuned . . .

It's true, Doug. I think the more bodyweight (fat) you have, the easier it is to sling the weights around.

Maybe the pro bodybuilders are just guys who can use poor form and jerk heavy weights around without getting injured - yeah, that's where their talent lies! (makes me feel better, I tell ya!)

I prefer not to cheat, too and I'm proud to say I've never injured myself beyond the little pull in the shoulder, pec or hamstring (I don't cheat, but didn't say I never try to use too much weight!).

The that make up the rotator cuff and knee, back and other parts can be really delicate, that's why I prefer to use slow, balanced movement using, as much as possible, the target muscle group, stabilizers and little else. I also work out my upper back and the backs of my shoulders a lot (did you notice?), because these muscles are said to help prevent shoulder problems.

Have a Good One,

Dave