Anyone else see the study about how degrees of religious belief in separated twins converge as they get older? that is, your degree of religious belief is primarily a function of your upbringing in your youth, but as you get older it becomes more genetically determined

Hey, torturing a child to death fits in perfectly with the god of the bible. The story of Job is simply revolting. To summarize, god tortures an innocent man, kills his family, destroys all his property, and reduces him to poverty and ill health all to win a bet he (god) made with satan.

Terri, I'm sorry to see you go, too. I too, enjoyed your posts, but totally understand where you're coming from. I hate that you had to defend yourself. Anyway, I hope you won't stay completely away from OH. Becky

Well I'm back from an intense workout and some time in the sauna. My email program is having some maintenance or something so I am blissfully unaware if anyone has sent me any *****y mail and I can just ENJOY Katie's post for the thoughtful, incisive discussion it is. This kind of posting is what this board was supposed to be about! But Katie, I warn you if you write me back that this response is rude I will be forced to do the mature thing. I will find where you live and leave a flaming bag of poo on your doorstep. I've noticed among various friends that they simply grow out of religion. Like you, they come to associate it with family connections and memories and those rites of passage like First Communion and the big dinner everybody went out for afterward at the restaurant with the fabulous ice cream sundaes. And what you remember most was the ice cream sundae. People grow up, they become educated, they notice that a cultural anthropology class answers more questions for them than Sunday School ever did, they become less involved with their extended family, and before you know it, their religious beliefs have evolved into something more like a personal spirituality. And why not? I've never had any real religious faith to abandon. I've been asked many times if I became disillusioned with religion and the answer would be no. I decided the whole thing seemed like a crock from the time I was about SEVEN. I can look at it and see the inherent illogic that I would never be able to get past. I do wonder why people still cling to it. It's all so completely irrational and even totally ridiculous to me that I can't figure out why anybody believes ANY of it anymore! The convoluted "explanations" people concoct to explain their god's "mysterious ways" are just too much for me. I can't figure out how they can talk themselves into that stuff. I could ask myself, what would I get if I decided to turn religious? What could I have that I dont' have now? Nothing! I'm already a darn happy person, especially now that I'm whipping the one big problem I've had all my life. I have a great family, great friends, peace in my mind and heart. Heck I even think I have a nice face that will only get better lookin' as I get smaller. Some religious people say they think their god gives them everything they have in their life. Well, I'm not wanting for anything so either he's giving it away to the heathens or I'm doing just fine on my own. OK then we're down to the whole "eternal life" issue. This is where it gets totally irrational to me on two levels. First of all, there's no evidence of any kind of spirit world or afterlife. So let's suspend our disbelief and consider this: I live a perfectly good life. I'm not a bad person. The Big Ten? I never "break" any of 'em. I'm a good daughter, a good friend, a good neighbor, a good citizen. I'm even a good driver! So after my ashes are put into that nice columbarium niche at Graceland Cemetery, let's say I find myself, my spirit self or whatever, at some kind of judgment day. St. Peter says talk to the hand because I didn't BELIEVE. I didn't WORSHIP. So this god who, if we follow religious logic, made me exactly as I am and would know everything about me, is pissed because I didn't suitably grovel in worship and supplication all my life. And for that I deserve for the trap door to open and I fall into some pit of flame where I can spend eternity roasting weenies with cool folks like John Lennon and Ayn Rand. Quite simply, why would I want to have anything to do with a god like that???? Sounds more like an abusive husband to me. Love me or suffer the consequences! Like I'm going to buy into that....

Sorry to read this. You have some interesting perspectives that I will miss reading. I understand your choice. I have opted not to respond to the faithful, as it is generally wasted pixels. It is interesting that the faithful are demonstrating just how overbearing they can be, and why we may want to be free of it, just for a short time. Tek