High carb diet vs. Calorie in/ calorie out.

Funny that you think DSers are high volume eaters, because many of us aren't anywhere close to that. It's like saying that all RNY's dump. We are grazers if anything, usually eating something every 2-3 hours to be independent of protein supplements. It's the protein and fat that make up the high calories, so it adds up fast. That's why I don't pay any attention to it.

Carbs are the devil for everyone, though. I enjoy veggies daily, however I'm mindful about simple carbs to not get out of control (and only after I'm filled up with protein).

You see, I use "volume" eaters since no matter how you look at it, one meal, or grazing - even high fat - to me 4000 cal that is a lot of food. I get that it may be OK for some people.

Even before RNY I often was not very hungry during the day and did not want to eat until late in the afternoon- evening. My biggest issues were sugars and sugary stuff. Most days I eat keto, higher fat - moderate proteins. But with RNY I have restrictions and I can get enough fat and proteins in 2-3 meals/snacks. Summer is here and I am lucky if I can get 3 meals. I have to make an effort to eat more fat. That's why for me - the RNY that restricts my volume per meal, plus make me uncomfortable when I eat too many sugary items. I used to dump in my first few years post op, now I get more discomfort, and gas. But I can easily eat a most of a chocolate if I want to. I just chose not to now eat it.

Okay, so our definition of volume eating differs. By your definition, I do apply then.

I ate like you before my DS, very little. I remember my dad telling me one day "It's amazing how obese you are with how little you eat". Yeah..that stung a little. My metabolism was completely whacked.

It took me some time to get over that way of eating, too. I rarely "feel" hungry in a traditional sense, but my body managed to figure out a way to let me know it's low on fuel. I can't describe it, but we have "an understanding". I must have gotten over it, though, because it's a standing joke now that "Val's always eating something" or always has to pee because I always have a beverage nearby too.

I had never heard of a high carb diet before. I do believe flawless weight loss comes from low carb diets though. Mostly because the carbs we like are cake/pie/chips, etc. For some people a little bit of carbs turn them into carb monsters. I have not experienced that since increasing by carbohydrates. While I am still "low carb" I am not keto low carb and I am happier that way.

Like Gwen said, most people suck at tracking. I actually saw this today on reddit and it made me laugh

It's so true. People don't track that bite of cake they ate at the office, or the few pieces of w/e they eat. It all adds up. A bite of cake could be.. 70 calories? That one cookie someone nibbled on 80-90 or more. No diet works without accountability!

So true! I track on myfitnesspal. If I bite it, I write it. I try to prelog my day. Sometimes that's not possible. I hate when I wake up at 300 am and realize I forgot to log something. I have to put it in right then or I can't sleep.

A-bloody-men!

I have numerous friends who are constantly "trying to lose weight" *****port and actually eat like the example you offered, if not worse.

Failure starts with the lies we tell ourselves.

So glad for this post this morning, as I'm struggling to find my balance on the maintenance. No, I don't think all calories are "equal" for me. I've been maintaining on 1200-1300 calories (I'm at 9 months and past goal). BUT I haven't felt great the last week. I know my calories are fine, but weight is up 4 lbs. This prompted me to go back to my tracker, and I have been meeting calories, but not with protein.

So back on track today. Thanks for the reminder that no matter what science says, everyone is unique in how they process food.

And FYI, the protein in PB and graham cracker (even small size) is not the same as the protein in chicken salad! Calories do not equal nutrition, nor necessarily supply what our particular body type/size/metabolism need to feel optimally.

You guys rock!

"CALORIES DO NOT EQUAL NUTRITION, nor necessarily supply what our particular body type/size/metabolism need to feel optimally."

I love this! I should probably tattoo those first five words right on the fronts of my hands. Maybe then I'd remember it before I eat a bad choice instead of immediately after.

I can eat much more calories and lose weight on Keto style diet than when I eat more carbs. My body is very sensitive to carbs. It overproduce insulin in response to carbs so my BS will go up initially then drop too low, and I have to eat to maintain my BS. But if I eat dense proteins and fat, with some non starchy veggies, my BS raises some, but not enough to stimulate "insulin storm".

FYI: the more processed the proteins (i.e whey isolate) the more they may affect the insulin response.

Check - google - info on "Food Insulin index". Knowing that even proteins require insulin, and knowing how lean protein affects our body, allow me to lose or maintain.

Plus -we are very individual, so for every one of us - our body may react differently to different foods.

Even though eggs don't have high insulin index, I don't get full and stay full eating eggs. If i eat just eggs, with very little fat, my BS would drop app 1-1.5 hours after I had eggs. That may be happening because I have a slight allergy to eggs.

Knowing your body, and your body reaction to different foods is important for some of us.

I've spoken to Ludwig (very briefly in a biochemistry discussion group we're both in). He's currently recruiting for a weight loss study where you stay on-site at a retreat and get reimbursed for staying there three months I believe. Dr. Ludwig's work is both promising and fascinating.

Obesity is caused by hormone dysregulation that is fueled by behavior. Many things drive fat storage and accumulation. Consider testosterone versus estrogen, for instance. Individuals who take testosterone but were born biologically female will see their body composition and fat distribution completely change. Hormones directly control where fat is stored, and the main hormone that does so is insulin. Ever notice diabetics switch insulin injection sites and rotate them? That's because insulin is the hormone that triggers fat storage. If you inject into the same site daily without changing it you will get a huge lump of fat there.

Macronutrients always matter more than calories, because the body uses ATP and not calories for energy. The body doesn't know what the heck a calorie is, for instance. The body breaks down macronutrients into their base components which we absorb and process to create ATP. Glucose provides a very quick way to do so, and we are genetically and biologically primed to store carbohydrate. Fat is less efficient to use as fuel, it's true - however with weight loss this is advantageous, actually, as it means we burn more calories to use it.

All weight loss surgeries that work well primarily do so through regulating hormones - it's *not* mostly the malabsorption or restriction that causes the weight loss. The more they study all the surgeries with metabolic effects, the more this is clear. Those surgeries which do this are: the vertical sleeve gastrectomy, the roux-n-y gastric bypass, and the duodenal switch and it's varied iterations and evolutions. All of these cause metabolic changes. The VSG has the least severe, and the duodenal switch and RNY have more prominent changes. The malabsorption does help keep weight off, but the primary mechanism for the initial loss is predominantly hormone-based. Metabolic surgeries reboot or reset many of the hormone receptors in the gut back to original factory specs. The malabsorption and restriction just helps with compliance more than anything.