Really freaked out! Thoughts re Dr. Amanza
(deactivated member)
on 3/25/10 12:26 pm
on 3/25/10 12:26 pm
Well, as a fellow published researcher, I'm sure you'd agree that qualitative resear*****luding but not limited to anecdotes and other experiential data are not generalizable.
All of my articles, including my book, are hard-copies. Even authors have to pay to get downloads of their papers.
I think your idea is a good one. I'm very interested in reading your publications as well. Why don't we make a trade? I'll scan in my articles and e-mail them if you send me yours. It would be great to exchange views on the research we've done and how it applies to WLS research on OH and otherwise.
All of my articles, including my book, are hard-copies. Even authors have to pay to get downloads of their papers.
I think your idea is a good one. I'm very interested in reading your publications as well. Why don't we make a trade? I'll scan in my articles and e-mail them if you send me yours. It would be great to exchange views on the research we've done and how it applies to WLS research on OH and otherwise.
On March 25, 2010 at 4:20 PM Pacific Time, TheDoubleFlame wrote:
I have been a qualitative researcher for more than 10 years and I'm published -- book, book chapters, journal articles, encyclopedia of case study research, etc.I don't wan't you to go to Almanza or anyone who will not serve your needs. I want you to be able to conduct a quality research process so that you can feel at ease with the decision only you can make because only you know all of your needs.
There have been some great posts in this thread and those are the ones that have the individual speaking only to her or his own experiences. That being said, I do not recommend using only OH as your only research source.
For instance, if you go to the thread "incision infection" you will see that infections can occur because patients may not take their antibiotics or they needed different antibiotics. Some people believe their experiences are due to the surgeon, others believe it's because of recovery. Still, other experiences are due to the individual's abilities to care for her/himself -- or not. Another on that thread projected an experience with a cat onto this forum about WLS. In another forum, VST.com, thread "how to find a good Mexican surgeon" (or similar) -- see Tell Your Story forum -- a poster says, basically: "I know everything because I have researched everything. Everything I say is credible because it is I who said it" -- yet this person has no first hand experience with the surgeon/centre she is promoting -- yikes!
There are three things I argue about using forums as research: 1) any assumption that it is not necessary to have had personal experience before you can fully recommend a surgeon/facility, is not correct and it is not supported by quality research processes; 2) no one is above having to back up their statements, and more than once or each time they post -- if they will not or cannot, there is something wrong; 3) the use of (daisy-) chain communication including but not limited to hearsay, is not effective.
On the detriments of hearsay, chain communication and quality of the research process, here are a few examples of published articles (two are by me and some by others).
The Encyclopedia of Case Study Research: "Storyselling" (2010) -- among other entries.
Qualitative Research Methods for the Social Sciences (1998)
The Journal of Organizational Change Management: "Coaching can be storyselling" (2007).
The Journal of Leadership Development: Understanding the charismatic leader-follower relationship: Promises and perils (1998).
Criteria for assessing the trustworthiness of naturalistic inquiries (1984).
The Crowd: A study of the popular mind (1974).
Principles of Management: "Communication" (2004). -- and pretty well every book on communication using the chain or "party-line" method.
Get the information you need from the horse's mouth -- the clinics themselves -- and get it in writing. Speak to the Mexican government about the surgeons/clinics. Go to the surgery site to see for yourself. By all means factor in previous patient's personal experiences -- but please, please remember, these are only a part of the research process.
Someone here has already said it and I agree: you must do your own independent research. You must quell your own fears.
I wish you only the very best while you determine what you need, when, and from whom you will get them.
Sometimes one doesn't need personal experience to know that a clinic is not great. I can read countless infections, leaks, perforated colons, perforated stomachs, etc., and it doesn't take rocket science to know - that's not a clinic I want to go to. A little common sense goes a long way.
What I don't get are the coordinators shoving this information under a rug, hiding it, lying about it.. .kinda like telling Marie S. that board certification is done differently in Mexico than it is in the US. A US surgeon has to take a test and pass it to be board certified. A MX surgeon pays the MX gov't $15,000 and they are board certified. Would you agree that this is a flat out lie? They take a test in MX too, *if* they pass it, they are board certified in Surgery.
I wonder the karma points someone wins for sending people to a place they have to lie about, especially on their website. For example, as of today one website ;o) has Betancourt's old clinic photos on there, not the new "clinic". One would almost think the coordinator was hiding what the new clinic looks like. Kind of a head scratcher, wouldn't you think?
BTW, I find your sig highly amusing... considering who you are and all. ;o)
(deactivated member)
on 3/27/10 10:27 am, edited 3/27/10 10:38 am
on 3/27/10 10:27 am, edited 3/27/10 10:38 am
WTH? are you talking about?
You are in denial about people's positive experiences.
Post the negative experiences.
Source your comments that secondary research and especially! from the internet -- which has not been provided -- is as reliable as someone's personal experience.
Prove out your implication that I am not who I say I am.
Prove out your statement that I have been sending anyone, anywhere.
Either put-up or shut-up -- that's common sense.
You are in denial about people's positive experiences.
Post the negative experiences.
Source your comments that secondary research and especially! from the internet -- which has not been provided -- is as reliable as someone's personal experience.
Prove out your implication that I am not who I say I am.
Prove out your statement that I have been sending anyone, anywhere.
Either put-up or shut-up -- that's common sense.
On March 27, 2010 at 5:27 PM Pacific Time, TheDoubleFlame wrote:
WTH? are you talking about?You are in denial about people's positive experiences.
Post the negative experiences.
Source your comments that secondary research and especially! from the internet -- which has not been provided -- is as reliable as someone's personal experience.
Prove out your implication that I am not who I say I am.
Prove out your statement that I have been sending anyone, anywhere.
Either put-up or shut-up -- that's common sense.
So you silly cow... who is it that you claim you are today? ;o))))))
I'm not in denial about positive experiences. Even a stopped clock is right two times a day.
I have 5 or so pages of examples. I have already offered to send them to anyone who wants them. Feel free to PM me an email address and I'll send them to you too.
However, I'm pretty sure I already have a few of your email addresses. You've tried this alter-ego thing many times over the time I've known you, you just aren't bright enough to pull it off.
You sure seem to have a vested interest in making sure NOBODY tells the negative things they know about this clinic. Don't you find that curious?
Isn't it time to drag out Fighting Fat now? You know, the one who always seems to post right after you do......
(deactivated member)
on 3/27/10 11:39 am
on 3/27/10 11:39 am
Given your state of mind that is easily discernible in your posts, it's not in my best interest to give you anything of mine that is personal.
You've got it wrong again. I want you to post. I don't know why you won't post the links to the different negative experiences you claim you have. I think everyone wants to know and this is an opportunity to show you know a little of what you speak (providing everything can be confirmed with timestamps, etc.) Something is just not right if you do not post those links.
It's too bad you do not have the courage of PeanutFreeMom but bullying is a non-courageous act. Shameful, really.
You've got it wrong again. I want you to post. I don't know why you won't post the links to the different negative experiences you claim you have. I think everyone wants to know and this is an opportunity to show you know a little of what you speak (providing everything can be confirmed with timestamps, etc.) Something is just not right if you do not post those links.
It's too bad you do not have the courage of PeanutFreeMom but bullying is a non-courageous act. Shameful, really.
On March 27, 2010 at 6:39 PM Pacific Time, TheDoubleFlame wrote:
Given your state of mind that is easily discernible in your posts, it's not in my best interest to give you anything of mine that is personal.You've got it wrong again. I want you to post. I don't know why you won't post the links to the different negative experiences you claim you have. I think everyone wants to know and this is an opportunity to show you know a little of what you speak (providing everything can be confirmed with timestamps, etc.) Something is just not right if you do not post those links.
It's too bad you do not have the courage of PeanutFreeMom but bullying is a non-courageous act. Shameful, really.
You know, you really gotta start changing your personality when you use these many fake IDs. You read like a book, you just aren't bright enough to try and pull this off.
Go back under your rock you cow.
What kind of coordinator are you? Sleezebag!
On March 27, 2010 at 6:39 PM Pacific Time, TheDoubleFlame wrote:
Given your state of mind that is easily discernible in your posts, it's not in my best interest to give you anything of mine that is personal.You've got it wrong again. I want you to post. I don't know why you won't post the links to the different negative experiences you claim you have. I think everyone wants to know and this is an opportunity to show you know a little of what you speak (providing everything can be confirmed with timestamps, etc.) Something is just not right if you do not post those links.
It's too bad you do not have the courage of PeanutFreeMom but bullying is a non-courageous act. Shameful, really.
http://www.obesityhelp.com/forums/VSG/4144041/This-is-WAY-ov er-the-top/action,replies/topic_id,4144041/page,4/
You will see the crazy PM she sent me. You'll also see the threatening email I received from Peanutfreemom aka Melanie. I think you, as well as others, will find much of the information in this post quite eye opening.
Sandy Johnston
Patient Care Coordinator
aLighterMe.com
On March 27, 2010 at 2:40 PM Pacific Time, MidwesternGirl wrote:
On March 25, 2010 at 4:20 PM Pacific Time, TheDoubleFlame wrote:
I have been a qualitative researcher for more than 10 years and I'm published -- book, book chapters, journal articles, encyclopedia of case study research, etc.I don't wan't you to go to Almanza or anyone who will not serve your needs. I want you to be able to conduct a quality research process so that you can feel at ease with the decision only you can make because only you know all of your needs.
There have been some great posts in this thread and those are the ones that have the individual speaking only to her or his own experiences. That being said, I do not recommend using only OH as your only research source.
For instance, if you go to the thread "incision infection" you will see that infections can occur because patients may not take their antibiotics or they needed different antibiotics. Some people believe their experiences are due to the surgeon, others believe it's because of recovery. Still, other experiences are due to the individual's abilities to care for her/himself -- or not. Another on that thread projected an experience with a cat onto this forum about WLS. In another forum, VST.com, thread "how to find a good Mexican surgeon" (or similar) -- see Tell Your Story forum -- a poster says, basically: "I know everything because I have researched everything. Everything I say is credible because it is I who said it" -- yet this person has no first hand experience with the surgeon/centre she is promoting -- yikes!
There are three things I argue about using forums as research: 1) any assumption that it is not necessary to have had personal experience before you can fully recommend a surgeon/facility, is not correct and it is not supported by quality research processes; 2) no one is above having to back up their statements, and more than once or each time they post -- if they will not or cannot, there is something wrong; 3) the use of (daisy-) chain communication including but not limited to hearsay, is not effective.
On the detriments of hearsay, chain communication and quality of the research process, here are a few examples of published articles (two are by me and some by others).
The Encyclopedia of Case Study Research: "Storyselling" (2010) -- among other entries.
Qualitative Research Methods for the Social Sciences (1998)
The Journal of Organizational Change Management: "Coaching can be storyselling" (2007).
The Journal of Leadership Development: Understanding the charismatic leader-follower relationship: Promises and perils (1998).
Criteria for assessing the trustworthiness of naturalistic inquiries (1984).
The Crowd: A study of the popular mind (1974).
Principles of Management: "Communication" (2004). -- and pretty well every book on communication using the chain or "party-line" method.
Get the information you need from the horse's mouth -- the clinics themselves -- and get it in writing. Speak to the Mexican government about the surgeons/clinics. Go to the surgery site to see for yourself. By all means factor in previous patient's personal experiences -- but please, please remember, these are only a part of the research process.
Someone here has already said it and I agree: you must do your own independent research. You must quell your own fears.
I wish you only the very best while you determine what you need, when, and from whom you will get them.
Sometimes one doesn't need personal experience to know that a clinic is not great. I can read countless infections, leaks, perforated colons, perforated stomachs, etc., and it doesn't take rocket science to know - that's not a clinic I want to go to. A little common sense goes a long way.
What I don't get are the coordinators shoving this information under a rug, hiding it, lying about it.. .kinda like telling Marie S. that board certification is done differently in Mexico than it is in the US. A US surgeon has to take a test and pass it to be board certified. A MX surgeon pays the MX gov't $15,000 and they are board certified. Would you agree that this is a flat out lie? They take a test in MX too, *if* they pass it, they are board certified in Surgery.
I wonder the karma points someone wins for sending people to a place they have to lie about, especially on their website. For example, as of today one website ;o) has Betancourt's old clinic photos on there, not the new "clinic". One would almost think the coordinator was hiding what the new clinic looks like. Kind of a head scratcher, wouldn't you think?
BTW, I find your sig highly amusing... considering who you are and all. ;o)
Who is that DoubleFlame anyway?
Lap Band March 2007
Band Slipped -Emergency Removal May 2008
Dr. Lopez Corvala- Hospital Angeles TJ
VSG Jan. 28th, 2010
Dr. Almanza-Jerusalem Clinic
Band Slipped -Emergency Removal May 2008
Dr. Lopez Corvala- Hospital Angeles TJ
VSG Jan. 28th, 2010
Dr. Almanza-Jerusalem Clinic
On March 31, 2010 at 8:28 PM Pacific Time, ishary wrote:
On March 27, 2010 at 2:40 PM Pacific Time, MidwesternGirl wrote:
On March 25, 2010 at 4:20 PM Pacific Time, TheDoubleFlame wrote:
I have been a qualitative researcher for more than 10 years and I'm published -- book, book chapters, journal articles, encyclopedia of case study research, etc.I don't wan't you to go to Almanza or anyone who will not serve your needs. I want you to be able to conduct a quality research process so that you can feel at ease with the decision only you can make because only you know all of your needs.
There have been some great posts in this thread and those are the ones that have the individual speaking only to her or his own experiences. That being said, I do not recommend using only OH as your only research source.
For instance, if you go to the thread "incision infection" you will see that infections can occur because patients may not take their antibiotics or they needed different antibiotics. Some people believe their experiences are due to the surgeon, others believe it's because of recovery. Still, other experiences are due to the individual's abilities to care for her/himself -- or not. Another on that thread projected an experience with a cat onto this forum about WLS. In another forum, VST.com, thread "how to find a good Mexican surgeon" (or similar) -- see Tell Your Story forum -- a poster says, basically: "I know everything because I have researched everything. Everything I say is credible because it is I who said it" -- yet this person has no first hand experience with the surgeon/centre she is promoting -- yikes!
There are three things I argue about using forums as research: 1) any assumption that it is not necessary to have had personal experience before you can fully recommend a surgeon/facility, is not correct and it is not supported by quality research processes; 2) no one is above having to back up their statements, and more than once or each time they post -- if they will not or cannot, there is something wrong; 3) the use of (daisy-) chain communication including but not limited to hearsay, is not effective.
On the detriments of hearsay, chain communication and quality of the research process, here are a few examples of published articles (two are by me and some by others).
The Encyclopedia of Case Study Research: "Storyselling" (2010) -- among other entries.
Qualitative Research Methods for the Social Sciences (1998)
The Journal of Organizational Change Management: "Coaching can be storyselling" (2007).
The Journal of Leadership Development: Understanding the charismatic leader-follower relationship: Promises and perils (1998).
Criteria for assessing the trustworthiness of naturalistic inquiries (1984).
The Crowd: A study of the popular mind (1974).
Principles of Management: "Communication" (2004). -- and pretty well every book on communication using the chain or "party-line" method.
Get the information you need from the horse's mouth -- the clinics themselves -- and get it in writing. Speak to the Mexican government about the surgeons/clinics. Go to the surgery site to see for yourself. By all means factor in previous patient's personal experiences -- but please, please remember, these are only a part of the research process.
Someone here has already said it and I agree: you must do your own independent research. You must quell your own fears.
I wish you only the very best while you determine what you need, when, and from whom you will get them.
Sometimes one doesn't need personal experience to know that a clinic is not great. I can read countless infections, leaks, perforated colons, perforated stomachs, etc., and it doesn't take rocket science to know - that's not a clinic I want to go to. A little common sense goes a long way.
What I don't get are the coordinators shoving this information under a rug, hiding it, lying about it.. .kinda like telling Marie S. that board certification is done differently in Mexico than it is in the US. A US surgeon has to take a test and pass it to be board certified. A MX surgeon pays the MX gov't $15,000 and they are board certified. Would you agree that this is a flat out lie? They take a test in MX too, *if* they pass it, they are board certified in Surgery.
I wonder the karma points someone wins for sending people to a place they have to lie about, especially on their website. For example, as of today one website ;o) has Betancourt's old clinic photos on there, not the new "clinic". One would almost think the coordinator was hiding what the new clinic looks like. Kind of a head scratcher, wouldn't you think?
BTW, I find your sig highly amusing... considering who you are and all. ;o)
Who is that DoubleFlame anyway?
I now have her blocked, she annoys me and life is too short.
Believe trash at your own risk. YOU verify your surgeon for your own self. YOU verifiy FACS, ASMBS, board certified in surgery. Do NOT take the word of another, YOU verify. Believe nobody, trust nobody, YOU verify you are being told truth.
If someone is not board certified, not ASMBS, not FACS, there IS a reason, you figure out why.
SOME people will tell you anything you want to hear to sell you surgery. You figure out if it is for real or not.
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