Meeting with Surgeon and surgery date set Sept. 21, 07

Hi, I met my surgeon for the first time on Aug 6th.  He is DR Ludemann with Kaiser Permanente.  I think it must be thier job to try and talk you out of surgery.  Dr Ludemann told me:  1 in 100 die, 1 in 3 will have a serious complication, the medical field has started seeing neuropathies that are permanent, can have lung damage.  He asked me this question "if I were a car salesman and told you I would sell you a new car but 1 in one hundred times you go out in this car it will be in a fatal accident, no one would buy this car", yet people say yes to this surgery.  He said he cannot tell me I would live longer, or have a better quality of life with this surgery.  He said it is the only surgery that is done that can cause harm.  He said I could do it on my own, I was doing it now.  I asked him if he believed in this surgery, he said I am having some trouble with it causing harm, as I took a oath to cause no harm.  He said I am going to leave the room and let you and your support person talk.  I asked how many of these surgeries he had done and he said 10, but he would have a surgeon with him who has done more than 100. He said he is currently seeing two people with major complications.  When he came back into the room all he said was "how does Sept 21 sound for a surgery date"?  I said great and he said he would have a very experienced surgeon with him. I have researched this pretty thourghly and new most of the complications he told me about.  I had waited along time to see the surgeon and was disaaapinted that he did not have one positive thing to say about the procedure.  That will not not deter me, I want and need this surgery. He als so said the first week at home I would need to give myself a blood thinner shot two times a week and B12 shots.  Is that normal? Thanks for any insight. Scooper 

Boy, I don't know if I would want this doctor operating on me........he certainly doesn't sound very encouraging and compassionate about what he does for a living............. Can't answer the question about the blood thinner.....

Uh oh!  Red flags!!  I would run run run from this surgeon.  Yes, there are lots of possible complications but this guy does not sound like he has the experience and confidence you would want in a surgeon.   The blood thinners probably isn't that unusual.  I had the shots for the couple of days I was in the hospital.  You may have some kind of medical history that he feels warrents thinners.

I think they all give you the "you might die" talk.  Actually, I think they are required to do it by law.  At OHSU, they not only have to tell you that, but they have to tell a family member too.  My sister said, "isn't there anything GOOD you can tell me?"  My surgeon then said that people of my size usually were not the high-risk patients (but he still couldn't guarantee me a great result), that he had a very low complication rate, that it is about the only way I would be able to lose the weight and keep it off, etc.  If you haven't read it, I would highly recommend Weight Loss Surgery:  A Lighter Look at a Heavy Subject.  It lays out all the dangers, but then tells you all the pluses too.  There's no such thing as having too much information going into this surgery.  Read all you can. I gave myself two blood thinner shots in the hospital, but haven't had to do it at home.  For B12, you can choose to put drops or tablets under your tongue every day or learn to give yourself the shots at home.  I chose the shots because I only have to do it once a month.  It's not really hard to do. Linda

Thanks so much for the reply.  This website is great!  I do believe that Kaiser has this canned message that they ask thier doctors to deliver pre-op.   Congratulations on your success!   What kind of protien drink do you recommend and does it taste good? Thanks, Scooper 312/288/165Goal

Scooper: I have not heard of Dr. Ludemann at Kaiser.  I had my surgery on August 22, 2006 with David Moiel.  I did have some complications where I got severly dehydrated, and wound up with having to have  a TPN  (intrevenous feeding) for almost a month.  I started out at 526 lbs and lost a majority of that pre-op, I have lost 258 lbs all together.  I started my journey on February 23, 2005. I am doing wonderful now, no complications,, I work out 3x a week with a trainer.  The only thing I hate now, is that I have alot of loose skin, and no amount of exercise is going to cure that.

 

Good luck with your journey,

 

Peggy

Thanks for the repy!  You are doing great, congrats on your weight loss!!!  Do you know if Kaiser has any more complications than others performing the RNY procedure? Thanks, Sandy

Scooper. He really said he had only done 10 surgeries. I am freeking out right now. I have an appointment with Dr. Ludemann in two weeks and you know with Kaiser we don't get a choice. Did he say who the other surgeon was that will be with him and what the major complications were that he was dealing with right now.  When we had the initial group meetings the other doctors seemed pretty upbeat about the procedure and how it can improve your health and also talked about risks. Do you come to any of the support groups at Kaiser? Any more information would be helpful.

Brenda

 

Yes, he really said 10.  He did not say which surgeon would be assisting him with my surgery.  I am going to ask Mary Lou to find out.  My post-op appointment is Sept 18th, I hope to learn more then.  Mary Lou said dshe would let him do the surgery on her, so I trust that.  He really tries to talk you out of the surgery, so be prepared.  The only support group I attend is on this website, which one do you attend?  Did you go through Bob's freedon from diets class in Salem? Look forward to hearing from you! Sandy

I am glad that you talked to Mary Lou. That is a little more reasuring. Do you mean your preop appt is Sept 18. I live in Vancouver and the last Saturday of every month they have support group meeting at Sunnyside from 10 to noon. Our group also has a kaiser only support group on a yahoo account. Email me at blay****[email protected] if you want info for that support group. Did he talk about your current weight loss or any issues with your body or skin. did he ask any questions or check anything before he gave you a surgery date? Did he give you info about how long you would be in the hospital or out of work? Did you ask about taking your galbladder out?