veterans adminstration and wls
Wayne, I wil just say this....You are welcome on this site no matter what you may think people say or think. You need the support as well as anyone does and do not be afraid of being jumped. We all have opinions and can be jumped at anytime, but we can all offer love and caring too. I tend to have a strong opinion of military and respect for this country. I do voice it. I don't want you to ever feel that you are not welcome to the love and support and advice this board has to offer you. Having said this....I am going to give my opinion here and it is just that....mine.
I don't think the government should GIVE anyone the surgery. The issue that I had a problem with, was not about the injustice you have been facing, It was at least to me...the fact that the way you were talking, it was if you felt the VA or the government was picking on you personally.
It is an overall problem, not directly pointed at one person. Maybe I am totally wrong in this, but I understand the lack of medical care in so many cir****tances, but in no other intitiy is there a conflict of these issues..... Hmmmm let me see...Do we pay for WLS for a vet or pay to have a mans legs amputated and give him a wheel chair to live in the rest of his life.To me there is no question. I do understand that WLS can also save a life....I am not insensitive to that at all as I face that myself. I do understand the issues at hand here. I do see there is a problem and a huge one, but I see friends get government jobs just to get WLS, when the average non government, citizen has to pay for their own when insurance wont cover it or they have no coverage. To me the government does not owe anyone WLS. My sister works for the military and is provided everthing she might need....Free medical, free prescrips, free eye care, many, many days of vacation time and sick leave, cheaper food from the base, cost of living increase every year and great pay and retirement. She has never gone to war one day in her 20 years. Do I think she also deserves free WLS? NO. I'm sorry I don't. She is no different than any other secretary in this society.
To me, for the VA to give people a criiteria to be met is only right. Most insurance companies do the same. I think having to lose weight before the surgery sucks, but I also know it is in my best interest to do so, so I do it. All the criteria they gave you was justified and in our best interest. I hate that I have to wait until Jan for my surgery because my heart doc says so....I could throw a fit and say he is picking on me...I may say he is just trying to cover his own butt, but I also know that it is in my best interest to listen to him and do what he asks...after all he knew what he was doing when he saved my life 3 times!! I don't like it...but I am waiting like he asked me to do.
I am glad you are finally getting to go to a doctor. Be thankful for that. Who cares where it is...be grateful. Sure it's stupid to have to go somewhere further away.....again the government is far...very far from perfect, but you ARE getting to go. I am happy for you for that! I pray that soon you will be able to have this surgery. I do hope that afterwards maybe you can become a voice for others in your same situation.Because you have lived it, you know what the problems are and maybe can do something about it. My policy is if you need a voice...be a voice for others. If you need somthing then you need to be that something to others! That is paying it forward or back to society.
Please let us know how your progress goes. Try to be positive and look forward. Above all, be thankful that you are able to have this surgery. There are many in this world who would love to be having it too.
Sherry
I don't think the government should GIVE anyone the surgery. The issue that I had a problem with, was not about the injustice you have been facing, It was at least to me...the fact that the way you were talking, it was if you felt the VA or the government was picking on you personally.
It is an overall problem, not directly pointed at one person. Maybe I am totally wrong in this, but I understand the lack of medical care in so many cir****tances, but in no other intitiy is there a conflict of these issues..... Hmmmm let me see...Do we pay for WLS for a vet or pay to have a mans legs amputated and give him a wheel chair to live in the rest of his life.To me there is no question. I do understand that WLS can also save a life....I am not insensitive to that at all as I face that myself. I do understand the issues at hand here. I do see there is a problem and a huge one, but I see friends get government jobs just to get WLS, when the average non government, citizen has to pay for their own when insurance wont cover it or they have no coverage. To me the government does not owe anyone WLS. My sister works for the military and is provided everthing she might need....Free medical, free prescrips, free eye care, many, many days of vacation time and sick leave, cheaper food from the base, cost of living increase every year and great pay and retirement. She has never gone to war one day in her 20 years. Do I think she also deserves free WLS? NO. I'm sorry I don't. She is no different than any other secretary in this society.
To me, for the VA to give people a criiteria to be met is only right. Most insurance companies do the same. I think having to lose weight before the surgery sucks, but I also know it is in my best interest to do so, so I do it. All the criteria they gave you was justified and in our best interest. I hate that I have to wait until Jan for my surgery because my heart doc says so....I could throw a fit and say he is picking on me...I may say he is just trying to cover his own butt, but I also know that it is in my best interest to listen to him and do what he asks...after all he knew what he was doing when he saved my life 3 times!! I don't like it...but I am waiting like he asked me to do.
I am glad you are finally getting to go to a doctor. Be thankful for that. Who cares where it is...be grateful. Sure it's stupid to have to go somewhere further away.....again the government is far...very far from perfect, but you ARE getting to go. I am happy for you for that! I pray that soon you will be able to have this surgery. I do hope that afterwards maybe you can become a voice for others in your same situation.Because you have lived it, you know what the problems are and maybe can do something about it. My policy is if you need a voice...be a voice for others. If you need somthing then you need to be that something to others! That is paying it forward or back to society.
Please let us know how your progress goes. Try to be positive and look forward. Above all, be thankful that you are able to have this surgery. There are many in this world who would love to be having it too.
Sherry
okcvet
on 10/24/08 3:23 am - Yukon, OK
on 10/24/08 3:23 am - Yukon, OK
Let me just say that I realize that everyone here is of the opinion that I believe the VA is picking on me. That is simply not true. Is it personal? Sure. But I started blogging and built a website dedicated to this because I want other vets to know what they are facing and hopeful because of my experiences in this they will be able to cut through the BS and streamline their efforts.
Now to the issue of WLS within the government, you are just plain wrong. I am a disabled veteran, and believe me nothing is FREE. I paid for everything I get and pay every single day and will for the rest of my life, so don't tell me that I'm just asking for a handout. I am of the opinion that every single person that needs WLS should have it. PERIOD. If they can have medicare, medicaid, private insurance, tricare, or the VA pay for then fantastic. As you should now the costs alone justify the surgery. If you want to bring the health issues into the room, then it is just absolutely justified to have surgery. Because of my very meager disability income, I cannot make payments on a loan for the surgery. If there was a way for me to do this without the VA it would have been done years ago. It is simply not possible for me, and many others in my situation to get the surgery any other way. My comments on going to Jackson is because I have and have had to become very frugal with my money that I as a taxpayer AM concerned about the crazy policies that exist within the VA.
Yes, a vet in a wheelchair should have the chair more of a priority than WLS. But you should realize that the vets that need that kind of care is being provided for. I also think, read my post, that giving $2.7 million taxpayer dollars to a graveyard is not prudent.
For you to say that I am throwing a fit and saying they are picking on me is absolutely not true. This whole mess over the VA got started because I asked a simple question that I genuinely wanted someone with more experience than me to answer. When I didn't get anything but they type of posts that you just posted I went out and found the answer to my question, and then posted the answer on my blog.
I have gotten emails from veterans all across the country that ARE going through the same types of things that I experienced. I also have had emails thanking me for giving others the courage to ask for and fight for WLS because of my experiences.
One of the reasons I came into this group was because I thought that I could get some support here. Everybody was supportive, informative and helpful. I don't have family support, and very little peer support so I came here. No matter what you or anyone else thinks I am in a different situation than most people here. I started to go to the meet and greats several times, but held back because I do and have been made to feel like an outsider.
Fire away, because I know it's coming.
Wayne
Now to the issue of WLS within the government, you are just plain wrong. I am a disabled veteran, and believe me nothing is FREE. I paid for everything I get and pay every single day and will for the rest of my life, so don't tell me that I'm just asking for a handout. I am of the opinion that every single person that needs WLS should have it. PERIOD. If they can have medicare, medicaid, private insurance, tricare, or the VA pay for then fantastic. As you should now the costs alone justify the surgery. If you want to bring the health issues into the room, then it is just absolutely justified to have surgery. Because of my very meager disability income, I cannot make payments on a loan for the surgery. If there was a way for me to do this without the VA it would have been done years ago. It is simply not possible for me, and many others in my situation to get the surgery any other way. My comments on going to Jackson is because I have and have had to become very frugal with my money that I as a taxpayer AM concerned about the crazy policies that exist within the VA.
Yes, a vet in a wheelchair should have the chair more of a priority than WLS. But you should realize that the vets that need that kind of care is being provided for. I also think, read my post, that giving $2.7 million taxpayer dollars to a graveyard is not prudent.
For you to say that I am throwing a fit and saying they are picking on me is absolutely not true. This whole mess over the VA got started because I asked a simple question that I genuinely wanted someone with more experience than me to answer. When I didn't get anything but they type of posts that you just posted I went out and found the answer to my question, and then posted the answer on my blog.
I have gotten emails from veterans all across the country that ARE going through the same types of things that I experienced. I also have had emails thanking me for giving others the courage to ask for and fight for WLS because of my experiences.
One of the reasons I came into this group was because I thought that I could get some support here. Everybody was supportive, informative and helpful. I don't have family support, and very little peer support so I came here. No matter what you or anyone else thinks I am in a different situation than most people here. I started to go to the meet and greats several times, but held back because I do and have been made to feel like an outsider.
Fire away, because I know it's coming.
Wayne
Wayne's Blog: http://okcvet.wordpress.com
Yes, it is coming...but not what you may expect as I am not that type of person. I made it very clear in my post, that the entire post was my own opinion of the situation....Just as voting for who I want to vote for is my own personal opinion. I also am respective of your rights to express your views though I may differ from them in some ways. You can and would get support from the posters on this board. None are judgemental people. No one comes to the meet and greets and are made to feel like an outsider. I personally will not ignore anyone because of their views on a subject, not even you!! Ok, that was a joke! My goodness if that was the case the OU Shirts and OSU shirts would call for an all out brawl!!
I want to say this too....In my opninion this is not a "Vet" issue. Many who have had this surgery or are having it, are making HUGE sacrafices to have this surgery. People are re-financing their homes, borrowing from anyone they can....and in my case, getting an early inheritance from my mother who honestly needs the money now for her to get by. She just wanted to help save my life. so she took money out of her anuity to help pay for most of my surgery. This surgery is not easy for anyone! Many out there, go without, because they can not afford it and yes, it is not just or fair! Many are so broke that can barely get by, but they are trying to find a way to get this surgery.
Why have surgery, if you are that broke? Because the risks and the cost of obesity are more than having the surgery. We all know that! I know wanting the surgery no matter what, or how broke you are! I agree it should be a universal right to have it and have it paid for, but that would come out of taxpayers pockets and that is just what we each are..... I can not say..I have paid my taxes and it is time for the government to give back to me and care for me. It doesn't work that way....I got myself in this condition! I did! I have to get myself out of it! That is a sacrafice no matter what! No one...owes it to me. It will be a sacrafice to do even with the extra's that aren't in the advertized price. Life is a struggle for everyone including "Vets" not just for "Vet's".
I have no insurance and have just finished 2 weeks of no insulin because I don't have the money to buy it.....Free clinics? That could be compared to the VA. as it is another broken part of the government programs......I live on no income right now, because I haven't been able to work because of my constant health issues. I can't work with blood sugars up in the 400's. I am on only about 25 carbs a day too. My daughter is helping me when she can....So I do understand living on very little to nothing and suffering the consequenses. I can't get medicade, because I am not disabled, 65 or blind. It all makes no difference....I just push on, trying to be positive in this life, no matter what. Today I was blessed by my doctor calling me and giving me enough insulin for a little over 2 months!! God opens doors and windows!
The bottom line is this: I am glad the system is finally being good to you and you are getting your surgery. The system may be broken right now, but this country deserves respect. It tears me up to hear constant bashing of the office of the President, the military, the VA, the flag....on and on. I don't care if it is deserving of it or not....I was taught to respect it! Everything is treated as a joke and with total disrespect. No wonder the country is in such a mess. I grew up respecting the office of the President, no matter how he sucked. I was taught to respect authority no matter if it was right or wrong. I was taught to respect the laws of this country and those who inforced it. I respect the men and woment of this country that joined the service to serve their country. I give them the support they need requardless of my approval or disapproval of the war. That is just how I was raised by my father who was a Col. in the Air Force.
My heart goes out to those who are disabled like you, who have given so much. As you can tell here, I have the upmost respect for the military and this country.....but I am sorry, I still just don't feel this country OWES you WLS. I think you should have your WLS. I just don't think you are owed it. Just like I am not owed the surgery. Right or wrong....that is how I feel. You are welcome to disagree with me also, and we can still stand in the same room and not beat the crap out of each other over it....
I hope you will come to a greet and meet and see that we are there to eat, meet and greet each other and not condem anyone for their feelings on anything.
Wayne, try to be positive....try to look past the negatives and be grateful you are getting your surgery. Try to be a positive force that goes out to correct the negatives....Focus on your future, put a smile on your face, and enjoy the process of your steps to this surgery. It was a hard fight but you are now nearly there! Also, by all means come to the next meet and greet. We are all grown ups that no matter what will welcome you into the fold. It may be a little wild at times but it is a great time for all! Please put all of this aside and join the group.
Sherry
I want to say this too....In my opninion this is not a "Vet" issue. Many who have had this surgery or are having it, are making HUGE sacrafices to have this surgery. People are re-financing their homes, borrowing from anyone they can....and in my case, getting an early inheritance from my mother who honestly needs the money now for her to get by. She just wanted to help save my life. so she took money out of her anuity to help pay for most of my surgery. This surgery is not easy for anyone! Many out there, go without, because they can not afford it and yes, it is not just or fair! Many are so broke that can barely get by, but they are trying to find a way to get this surgery.
Why have surgery, if you are that broke? Because the risks and the cost of obesity are more than having the surgery. We all know that! I know wanting the surgery no matter what, or how broke you are! I agree it should be a universal right to have it and have it paid for, but that would come out of taxpayers pockets and that is just what we each are..... I can not say..I have paid my taxes and it is time for the government to give back to me and care for me. It doesn't work that way....I got myself in this condition! I did! I have to get myself out of it! That is a sacrafice no matter what! No one...owes it to me. It will be a sacrafice to do even with the extra's that aren't in the advertized price. Life is a struggle for everyone including "Vets" not just for "Vet's".
I have no insurance and have just finished 2 weeks of no insulin because I don't have the money to buy it.....Free clinics? That could be compared to the VA. as it is another broken part of the government programs......I live on no income right now, because I haven't been able to work because of my constant health issues. I can't work with blood sugars up in the 400's. I am on only about 25 carbs a day too. My daughter is helping me when she can....So I do understand living on very little to nothing and suffering the consequenses. I can't get medicade, because I am not disabled, 65 or blind. It all makes no difference....I just push on, trying to be positive in this life, no matter what. Today I was blessed by my doctor calling me and giving me enough insulin for a little over 2 months!! God opens doors and windows!
The bottom line is this: I am glad the system is finally being good to you and you are getting your surgery. The system may be broken right now, but this country deserves respect. It tears me up to hear constant bashing of the office of the President, the military, the VA, the flag....on and on. I don't care if it is deserving of it or not....I was taught to respect it! Everything is treated as a joke and with total disrespect. No wonder the country is in such a mess. I grew up respecting the office of the President, no matter how he sucked. I was taught to respect authority no matter if it was right or wrong. I was taught to respect the laws of this country and those who inforced it. I respect the men and woment of this country that joined the service to serve their country. I give them the support they need requardless of my approval or disapproval of the war. That is just how I was raised by my father who was a Col. in the Air Force.
My heart goes out to those who are disabled like you, who have given so much. As you can tell here, I have the upmost respect for the military and this country.....but I am sorry, I still just don't feel this country OWES you WLS. I think you should have your WLS. I just don't think you are owed it. Just like I am not owed the surgery. Right or wrong....that is how I feel. You are welcome to disagree with me also, and we can still stand in the same room and not beat the crap out of each other over it....
I hope you will come to a greet and meet and see that we are there to eat, meet and greet each other and not condem anyone for their feelings on anything.
Wayne, try to be positive....try to look past the negatives and be grateful you are getting your surgery. Try to be a positive force that goes out to correct the negatives....Focus on your future, put a smile on your face, and enjoy the process of your steps to this surgery. It was a hard fight but you are now nearly there! Also, by all means come to the next meet and greet. We are all grown ups that no matter what will welcome you into the fold. It may be a little wild at times but it is a great time for all! Please put all of this aside and join the group.
Sherry
(deactivated member)
on 10/24/08 4:04 am
on 10/24/08 4:04 am
Wayne, we are all here to fight a common enemy-obesity-in that, there are no outsiders.
Unfortunately, obesity is still considered a cosmetic or a self inflicted disease, and as such isn't getting the support from insurance public or private.
But remember, everybody's fat is personal-at least to them. I think somewhere I got the impression that you were saying as a veteran, you were more worthy of WLS or should have more consideration. But, maybe that was MY OWN feelings of non worthiness creeping in-(a lot of overweight people have self esteem problems). And those kinds of conversations are never productive and always full of conflict.....and silly-MY FAT is better than YOUR FAT? LOL. Again, I am just sharing my perception, and I agree fully that is full of my own baggage.
I'm a self pay, denied by insurance several times and other than my folks, no one has ever expressed outrage that I had to do it myself, and in fact some have said, bluntly-"since you did it to yourself why should anyone pay for it?" I guess my point is, if private insurance is allowed to deny, why not public? And yes, it is an outrage, but it's an outrage across the board.
It's such a messed up thing-because there are some "fighters" who would say I sold out by just paying my way-and I thought so too-but then I realized my real goal was to get healthy, not change to change the insurance system in this country.
You seem very focused, and I would just hope that you turn that focus and energy on something that benefits you the most-and I'm not sure this is it-but I will continue to support your right to choose.
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