a msg i got today-do people really do this?
Ok, so i logged on today and had a msg from someone named Nicole (something like that) she said she read my stuff and does not know why i want to have the band. She said i should have the ds because i will not lose the 170lbs i want to with the band. WTH is up with that? I could not even reply back to her, it did not give me the option to. First she says she means no harm but how can someone have the nerve to suggest to me another type of wls? If she had read my posts then she would know I have debated my decision. Further more, i have read and seen plenty of band people who have lost over 150lbs. It's a toll to help me, it's not gonna melt the fat away and restructure my body.
Anyway i'm just a bit pissed off i even got a msg like that and i find it weird that it does not give me the option to reply back to her!
Thanks for the vent!
Anyway i'm just a bit pissed off i even got a msg like that and i find it weird that it does not give me the option to reply back to her!
Thanks for the vent!
Well, the reason that you possibly cannot respond back is that her profile might be made private. If her name is in black and not blue (the blue creates a hyperlink- black then it is private) I do believe that the message person was just trying to be helpful and you will see that on the boards over and over that they will suggest one surgery over another. Some people are very passionate regarding their particular surgery. Please do not take it the wrong way as I do think that she was trying to be helpful.
Please do not cut and paste her PM here as it was sent to you in private and should remain private. Actually you really should have not mentioned her name even here.
Please do not cut and paste her PM here as it was sent to you in private and should remain private. Actually you really should have not mentioned her name even here.
Open RNY May 7
260/155/140
Christine,
(I am sorry, but I feel I must reply to YOU since Shawn immediately blocked me, instead of simply sending me a PM. I would consider it a kindness if you could "quote" me, so that she may read my response, since she has me blocked. Thank you!) I have only blocked ONE person in my years on OH and that is because this creepy stalker asked one too many questions about seeing pictures of my kids and hubby.
Thank you for your discretion Christine, but it was in vain, as Shawn posted this crap on the main board, too. Instead of sending me a PM, like an adult, she blew up the MB and the Illinois board in an effort to, well, I have NO idea what she was trying to accomplish by this foolishness.
In case anyone would LIKE to read it, here is the PM (which stands for "PRIVATE MESSAGE," Shawn!) I sent Shawn today, in its entirety. I did NOT say this on the board, I chose to send her a PM. Since it is mine, I can post it here.
I have met many people on the IL in person and had in-person, online and PM "conversations" with lots of you about surgery types. This PM is nothing I have not said in person or online here before, so I have no worries of privacy or being "caught" saying something out of turn. You all know how I feel about the DS and its success rate and resolution of type 2 diabetes compared to other surgeries. You know how I feel about pouch versus a fully-functioning stomach, etc.
As you will all see, I was very polite in my PM to Shawn and was trying to help her. In particular:
Please know that I do this in the spirit of kindness. I'd like you to be able to benefit from my exhaustive research, since our stories are similar. No matter what you decide, I will support your choice of surgery type.
Juanita, I thank you for trying to be a voice of reason here and on the main board. Your friendship means a lot.
Shawn, if this is any indication of your personality, you may be too immature to have weight loss surgery. It requires some patience, maturity and thoughtfui planning. I hope you get some pre-op counseling. I wish you success.
Nicolle
(I am sorry, but I feel I must reply to YOU since Shawn immediately blocked me, instead of simply sending me a PM. I would consider it a kindness if you could "quote" me, so that she may read my response, since she has me blocked. Thank you!) I have only blocked ONE person in my years on OH and that is because this creepy stalker asked one too many questions about seeing pictures of my kids and hubby.
Thank you for your discretion Christine, but it was in vain, as Shawn posted this crap on the main board, too. Instead of sending me a PM, like an adult, she blew up the MB and the Illinois board in an effort to, well, I have NO idea what she was trying to accomplish by this foolishness.
In case anyone would LIKE to read it, here is the PM (which stands for "PRIVATE MESSAGE," Shawn!) I sent Shawn today, in its entirety. I did NOT say this on the board, I chose to send her a PM. Since it is mine, I can post it here.
I have met many people on the IL in person and had in-person, online and PM "conversations" with lots of you about surgery types. This PM is nothing I have not said in person or online here before, so I have no worries of privacy or being "caught" saying something out of turn. You all know how I feel about the DS and its success rate and resolution of type 2 diabetes compared to other surgeries. You know how I feel about pouch versus a fully-functioning stomach, etc.
As you will all see, I was very polite in my PM to Shawn and was trying to help her. In particular:
Please know that I do this in the spirit of kindness. I'd like you to be able to benefit from my exhaustive research, since our stories are similar. No matter what you decide, I will support your choice of surgery type.
Juanita, I thank you for trying to be a voice of reason here and on the main board. Your friendship means a lot.
Shawn, if this is any indication of your personality, you may be too immature to have weight loss surgery. It requires some patience, maturity and thoughtfui planning. I hope you get some pre-op counseling. I wish you success.
Nicolle
Personal message
| Date Sent: | January 10, 2010 - 1:15pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| To: | shawnm Click here to add this user to your friends list | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Subject: | Diabetes, Expectations, etc. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Hi, Shawn! I saw your posts this week and wanted to get back to you on a couple of things that are probably NOT my business, but I'd like to help you if I can...I KNOW you are excited, but please temper your excitement with some reality. Please know that I do this in the spirit of kindness. I'd like you to be able to benefit from my exhaustive research, since our stories are similar. No matter what you decide, I will support your choice of surgery type. 1) Your weight and expectations. With 170 pounds to lose, I am VERY surprised that your doc is recommending the LapBand. It is VERY unlikely that you will get to goal weight with a restriction-only surgery like the band or VSG. It is even more unlikely that you will get there and stay there for any length of time. The American Society of Metabolic and Bariatric Surgeons published this data about the various surgeries all of its members do. See page 10 of this document for an easy-to-read chart on the main four type of WLS: http://www.aace.com/pub/pdf/guidelines/Bariatric.pdf Basically, it says, that at: 1-2 years, band patients will have lost between 29-87% of excess weight (good, right?) 3-6 years, band patients will have lost between 45-72% of excess weight (okay, right?) 7-10 years, band patients will have lost between 14-60% of excess weight (bad, right?) If you are merely "average," after 7-10 years of living with the ups and down with the band (expensive fills, foamies, possible surgery for complications, etc.), you will likely have lost only between 23 to 102 pounds and very likely NOT resolved your diabetes (see info below on diabetes remission/cure). Will that be worth it to you? In other words, band patients will take off weight in the beginning and gain most of it back. Since you have described yourself as someone who eats when stressed, etc. how likely is it that you will change that behavior? With the DS, I can still eat food when I am stressed, especially if it is fatty, protein-y type food like McDonald's or pizza if I think I "need" to. WLS is not on your head, so these attitudes and behaviors you have now will STILL continue to be there after surgery. I wanted to stack the deck in my favor for emotional slippages, from time to time. I had 189 pounds to lose and even some of Chicago's top band salespeople--er, doctors--told me that I would never get to goal that way and that it would NOT help my diabetes, especially when the weight came back on, which they told me it most likely would. I am grateful to them for their honesty. Then, again, they were trying to steer me to get their RNYs, but I digress! I chose the duodenal switch because I had lots of weight to lose (and keep off!) and I had type 2 diabetes and wanted that CURED. The RNY was completely out of the question for me, as I think it is barbaric. As a contrast, here are the DS's weight loss numbers in comparable periods, according to the ASMBS: 1-2 years, DS patients will have lost between 65-83% of excess weight 3-6 years, DS patients will have lost between 62-81% of excess weight 7-10 years, DS patients will have lost between 60-80% of excess weight I liked my odds better with the DS! Please check out the revisions forum here on OH and ask people about their band experiences. It will be eye-opening about how invasive the band really is, etc. Even some Illinois people were complaining about their bands the other day here. Contrary to what the manufacturers say, it is MAJOR surgery and it can have MAJOR complications, from erosion of your stomach and esophagus to slippage and day-to-day issues like foamies. If you watch these boards, you'll see that many countries in Europe have stopped using the band at all, due to failure. It is testimony to both band's manufacturers that it is experiencing a resurgence in this country. I'm betting that it won't be long until the band is history here, too. 2) I see on your profile that you have diabetes. Is it Type 2?? If so, I just wanted to make you aware of a few things. I had the DS about 2 years ago and it CURED my Type 2 diabetes. I was freshly diagnosed, so my body was still capable of producing insulin. I effortlessly have lost almost 200 pounds eating foods I love, from cheese to meat to desserts and my diabetes is GONE. The DS has the best long-term resolution of Type 2 diabetes. It is not related to the amount of weight you lose BUT the metabolic shift the DS creates in your body. Once regain happens with the other surgeries, the diabetes often comes back with a vengeance. Please check out jillbean720's profile here on OH. Just search for her name under "People" to read all of the scientific data and studies on diabetes and the DS and RNY. Here are just some studies for you to review if you have not yet: (The first one is by Dr. Prachand at the University of Chicago, the ONLY hospital in the Chicago area that REALLY does the DS--unless you talk to a REAL DS surgeon, you will NOT get accurate, current info on the DS. The Lexus dealer will not tell you positive info about the Ford cars and vice versa. Dr. Joyce has NOT been trained to do the DS, which would have involved leaving his lucrative practice for several months and proctoring under a skilled DS surgeon.) J Gastrointest Surg. 2009 Nov 24. [Epub ahead of print] Duodenal Switch Provides Superior Resolution of Metabolic Comorbidities Independent of Weight Loss in the Super-obese (BMI >/= 50 kg/m(2)) Compared with Gastric Bypass.Prachand VN, Ward M, Alverdy JC. Section of General Surgery, Department of Surgery, University of Chicago Medical Center, 5841 S. Maryland Ave. MC 5036, Chicago, IL, 60637, USA, [email protected]. OBJECTIVE: Increased body mass index is associated with greater incidence and severity of obesity-related comorbidities and inadequate postbariatric surgery weight loss. Accordingly, comorbidity resolution is an important measure of surgical outcome in super-obese individuals. We previously reported superior weight loss in super-obese patients following duodenal switch (DS) compared to Roux-en-Y gastric bypass (RYGB) in a large single institution series. We now report follow-up comparison of comorbidity resolution and correlation with weight loss. Obesity Related Illnesses that Improved/Resolved Following Weight Loss Surgery:
Buchwald, H. Bariatric Surgery, A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis. JAMA, October 13, 2004-Vol 292, No. 14 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And some interesting quotes from http://care.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/content/full/31/Supplem ent_2/S290 Diabetes Care 31:S290-S296, 2008 DOI: 10.2337/dc08-s271 © 2008 by the American Diabetes Association ----------------------------------------------------------------------- As far as insurance goes, BCBS of IL does cover the DS, since September 2009. Best of luck to you, no matter what you decide! Feel free to send me a private message if you'd like to talk. Also, please check out the DS forum here on OH and www.dsfacts.com for more info. Nicolle |
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I had the kick-butt duodenal switch (DS)!
HW: 344 lbs CW: 150 lbs
Type 2 diabetes and sleep apnea GONE!
On January 11, 2010 at 12:09 AM Pacific Time, Nicolle wrote:
Christine, (I am sorry, but I feel I must reply to YOU since Shawn immediately blocked me, instead of simply sending me a PM. I would consider it a kindness if you could "quote" me, so that she may read my response, since she has me blocked. Thank you!) I have only blocked ONE person in my years on OH and that is because this creepy stalker asked one too many questions about seeing pictures of my kids and hubby.
Thank you for your discretion Christine, but it was in vain, as Shawn posted this crap on the main board, too. Instead of sending me a PM, like an adult, she blew up the MB and the Illinois board in an effort to, well, I have NO idea what she was trying to accomplish by this foolishness.
In case anyone would LIKE to read it, here is the PM (which stands for "PRIVATE MESSAGE," Shawn!) I sent Shawn today, in its entirety. I did NOT say this on the board, I chose to send her a PM. Since it is mine, I can post it here.
I have met many people on the IL in person and had in-person, online and PM "conversations" with lots of you about surgery types. This PM is nothing I have not said in person or online here before, so I have no worries of privacy or being "caught" saying something out of turn. You all know how I feel about the DS and its success rate and resolution of type 2 diabetes compared to other surgeries. You know how I feel about pouch versus a fully-functioning stomach, etc.
As you will all see, I was very polite in my PM to Shawn and was trying to help her. In particular:
Please know that I do this in the spirit of kindness. I'd like you to be able to benefit from my exhaustive research, since our stories are similar. No matter what you decide, I will support your choice of surgery type.
Juanita, I thank you for trying to be a voice of reason here and on the main board. Your friendship means a lot.
Shawn, if this is any indication of your personality, you may be too immature to have weight loss surgery. It requires some patience, maturity and thoughtfui planning. I hope you get some pre-op counseling. I wish you success.
Nicolle
Personal message
| Date Sent: | January 10, 2010 - 1:15pm | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| To: | shawnm Click here to add this user to your friends list | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Subject: | Diabetes, Expectations, etc. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Hi, Shawn! I saw your posts this week and wanted to get back to you on a couple of things that are probably NOT my business, but I'd like to help you if I can...I KNOW you are excited, but please temper your excitement with some reality. Please know that I do this in the spirit of kindness. I'd like you to be able to benefit from my exhaustive research, since our stories are similar. No matter what you decide, I will support your choice of surgery type. 1) Your weight and expectations. With 170 pounds to lose, I am VERY surprised that your doc is recommending the LapBand. It is VERY unlikely that you will get to goal weight with a restriction-only surgery like the band or VSG. It is even more unlikely that you will get there and stay there for any length of time. The American Society of Metabolic and Bariatric Surgeons published this data about the various surgeries all of its members do. See page 10 of this document for an easy-to-read chart on the main four type of WLS: http://www.aace.com/pub/pdf/guidelines/Bariatric.pdf Basically, it says, that at: 1-2 years, band patients will have lost between 29-87% of excess weight (good, right?) 3-6 years, band patients will have lost between 45-72% of excess weight (okay, right?) 7-10 years, band patients will have lost between 14-60% of excess weight (bad, right?) If you are merely "average," after 7-10 years of living with the ups and down with the band (expensive fills, foamies, possible surgery for complications, etc.), you will likely have lost only between 23 to 102 pounds and very likely NOT resolved your diabetes (see info below on diabetes remission/cure). Will that be worth it to you? In other words, band patients will take off weight in the beginning and gain most of it back. Since you have described yourself as someone who eats when stressed, etc. how likely is it that you will change that behavior? With the DS, I can still eat food when I am stressed, especially if it is fatty, protein-y type food like McDonald's or pizza if I think I "need" to. WLS is not on your head, so these attitudes and behaviors you have now will STILL continue to be there after surgery. I wanted to stack the deck in my favor for emotional slippages, from time to time. I had 189 pounds to lose and even some of Chicago's top band salespeople--er, doctors--told me that I would never get to goal that way and that it would NOT help my diabetes, especially when the weight came back on, which they told me it most likely would. I am grateful to them for their honesty. Then, again, they were trying to steer me to get their RNYs, but I digress! I chose the duodenal switch because I had lots of weight to lose (and keep off!) and I had type 2 diabetes and wanted that CURED. The RNY was completely out of the question for me, as I think it is barbaric. As a contrast, here are the DS's weight loss numbers in comparable periods, according to the ASMBS: 1-2 years, DS patients will have lost between 65-83% of excess weight 3-6 years, DS patients will have lost between 62-81% of excess weight 7-10 years, DS patients will have lost between 60-80% of excess weight I liked my odds better with the DS! Please check out the revisions forum here on OH and ask people about their band experiences. It will be eye-opening about how invasive the band really is, etc. Even some Illinois people were complaining about their bands the other day here. Contrary to what the manufacturers say, it is MAJOR surgery and it can have MAJOR complications, from erosion of your stomach and esophagus to slippage and day-to-day issues like foamies. If you watch these boards, you'll see that many countries in Europe have stopped using the band at all, due to failure. It is testimony to both band's manufacturers that it is experiencing a resurgence in this country. I'm betting that it won't be long until the band is history here, too. 2) I see on your profile that you have diabetes. Is it Type 2?? If so, I just wanted to make you aware of a few things. I had the DS about 2 years ago and it CURED my Type 2 diabetes. I was freshly diagnosed, so my body was still capable of producing insulin. I effortlessly have lost almost 200 pounds eating foods I love, from cheese to meat to desserts and my diabetes is GONE. The DS has the best long-term resolution of Type 2 diabetes. It is not related to the amount of weight you lose BUT the metabolic shift the DS creates in your body. Once regain happens with the other surgeries, the diabetes often comes back with a vengeance. Please check out jillbean720's profile here on OH. Just search for her name under "People" to read all of the scientific data and studies on diabetes and the DS and RNY. Here are just some studies for you to review if you have not yet: (The first one is by Dr. Prachand at the University of Chicago, the ONLY hospital in the Chicago area that REALLY does the DS--unless you talk to a REAL DS surgeon, you will NOT get accurate, current info on the DS. The Lexus dealer will not tell you positive info about the Ford cars and vice versa. Dr. Joyce has NOT been trained to do the DS, which would have involved leaving his lucrative practice for several months and proctoring under a skilled DS surgeon.) J Gastrointest Surg. 2009 Nov 24. [Epub ahead of print] Duodenal Switch Provides Superior Resolution of Metabolic Comorbidities Independent of Weight Loss in the Super-obese (BMI >/= 50 kg/m(2)) Compared with Gastric Bypass.Prachand VN, Ward M, Alverdy JC. Section of General Surgery, Department of Surgery, University of Chicago Medical Center, 5841 S. Maryland Ave. MC 5036, Chicago, IL, 60637, USA, [email protected]. OBJECTIVE: Increased body mass index is associated with greater incidence and severity of obesity-related comorbidities and inadequate postbariatric surgery weight loss. Accordingly, comorbidity resolution is an important measure of surgical outcome in super-obese individuals. We previously reported superior weight loss in super-obese patients following duodenal switch (DS) compared to Roux-en-Y gastric bypass (RYGB) in a large single institution series. We now report follow-up comparison of comorbidity resolution and correlation with weight loss. Obesity Related Illnesses that Improved/Resolved Following Weight Loss Surgery:
Buchwald, H. Bariatric Surgery, A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis. JAMA, October 13, 2004-Vol 292, No. 14 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And some interesting quotes from http://care.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/content/full/31/Supplem ent_2/S290 Diabetes Care 31:S290-S296, 2008 DOI: 10.2337/dc08-s271 © 2008 by the American Diabetes Association ----------------------------------------------------------------------- As far as insurance goes, BCBS of IL does cover the DS, since September 2009. Best of luck to you, no matter what you decide! Feel free to send me a private message if you'd like to talk. Also, please check out the DS forum here on OH and www.dsfacts.com for more info. Nicolle |
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Open RNY May 7
260/155/140
Thank YOU Christine for posting my response--as I had asked you to do for me--so that Shawn could read it, since she blocked me after she read my PM. I consider this a personal favor.
Her original complaint about not being able to reply to me is her own issue. You cannot reply to someone you blocked, Shawn.
Nicolle
Her original complaint about not being able to reply to me is her own issue. You cannot reply to someone you blocked, Shawn.
Nicolle
I had the kick-butt duodenal switch (DS)!
HW: 344 lbs CW: 150 lbs
Type 2 diabetes and sleep apnea GONE!
Hi Nicolle,
Even though I was "stuck" with RNY (would have had to pay out of pocket for DS, and no can do!), I would have been appreciative of your post when I was originally set on getting the band. It was a very thoughtful, respectful post with good data.
I was lucky enough to have a surgeon who was up front with me re: the stats for the different surgeries and that helped me make a decision. It was kind of you to take the time to help another OH'er even if she didn't take the post in the spirit it was sent.
Stephanie
Even though I was "stuck" with RNY (would have had to pay out of pocket for DS, and no can do!), I would have been appreciative of your post when I was originally set on getting the band. It was a very thoughtful, respectful post with good data.
I was lucky enough to have a surgeon who was up front with me re: the stats for the different surgeries and that helped me make a decision. It was kind of you to take the time to help another OH'er even if she didn't take the post in the spirit it was sent.
Stephanie
Thanks for your support, Stephanie.
Yes, the money part of bariatrics is very frustrating. I hope someday we get to a point that we no longer need a surgical intervention. A nice splice to the obesity gene or a super pill would do it, right?
BTW, I'd say you are kickin' some butt with your RNY! "Weigh" to go!
Nicolle
Yes, the money part of bariatrics is very frustrating. I hope someday we get to a point that we no longer need a surgical intervention. A nice splice to the obesity gene or a super pill would do it, right?
BTW, I'd say you are kickin' some butt with your RNY! "Weigh" to go!
Nicolle
I had the kick-butt duodenal switch (DS)!
HW: 344 lbs CW: 150 lbs
Type 2 diabetes and sleep apnea GONE!
On January 10, 2010 at 3:28 PM Pacific Time, ChristineB wrote:
Well, the reason that you possibly cannot respond back is that her profile might be made private. If her name is in black and not blue (the blue creates a hyperlink- black then it is private) I do believe that the message person was just trying to be helpful and you will see that on the boards over and over that they will suggest one surgery over another. Some people are very passionate regarding their particular surgery. Please do not take it the wrong way as I do think that she was trying to be helpful.
Please do not cut and paste her PM here as it was sent to you in private and should remain private. Actually you really should have not mentioned her name even here. and based on your own suggestion, you cut and pasted her msg, and i agree with you on one issue, i should not have mentioned her by her name, that i apologize for, i could have left her name out.
So basically i am done with the back and forth and people who send unsolicited surgery suggestions.
Please do not cut and paste her PM here as it was sent to you in private and should remain private. Actually you really should have not mentioned her name even here. and based on your own suggestion, you cut and pasted her msg, and i agree with you on one issue, i should not have mentioned her by her name, that i apologize for, i could have left her name out.
So basically i am done with the back and forth and people who send unsolicited surgery suggestions.
On January 11, 2010 at 4:56 AM Pacific Time, shawnm wrote:
On January 10, 2010 at 3:28 PM Pacific Time, ChristineB wrote:
Well, the reason that you possibly cannot respond back is that her profile might be made private. If her name is in black and not blue (the blue creates a hyperlink- black then it is private) I do believe that the message person was just trying to be helpful and you will see that on the boards over and over that they will suggest one surgery over another. Some people are very passionate regarding their particular surgery. Please do not take it the wrong way as I do think that she was trying to be helpful.Please do not cut and paste her PM here as it was sent to you in private and should remain private. Actually you really should have not mentioned her name even here.
So basically i am done with the back and forth and people who send unsolicited surgery suggestions.
Open RNY May 7
260/155/140
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