Another one of those "vitamin" threads

I'm getting a revision done today and would like to contact Vitalady. Can someone send me her contact info please? Thanks. 

Her website is easy to find - just goggle vitalady.  Or put in her name with a .com after it.

Larra

Thanks, got it! I thought it was a handle on here :) 

I agree with everything that Larra recommends, and also want to add that my doc also led me along a bad path.

I was sold Vita4Life (designer vitamin specifically for wls patients) from her office, which had a specific dosage printed for DS patients.  I was told to take the DS dosage and extra calcium and it was "all I needed".  My first labs showed low D.  She said let's take another 400iu and wait to see next round.  My next labs had my D levels at 12...dangerously low.  She shrugged her shoulders and said "how about another 400iu?"  By this time, I'd been reading about the importance of dry vitamins for D, A and K with DS.  This was never recommended for me.  I was also learning that other DS patients were seeing results with crazy-high dosages.  It took me another year of taking 100,000iu, then 50,000 iu to get my D back into range.  It took me about the same amount of time to get my A into a healthy range taking 50,000 iu then 25,000 iu.  Today, 9 yrs later, I still take 50,000iu of D and 25,000iu of A and I'm holding steady. 

I have heard (and someone correct me if I'm wrong) that Nutritionists must speak to whatever National standards are set for recommendations, and there aren't any truly specific to the DS.  They are bound by their certification not to sway from those standards despite the lack of true DS information. 

Flintstones -- FLINTSTONES???? That baffles me.  Just get some Centrum (yanno - for grown ups) and take a double-dose.  You don't need chewables, just take your time at first.  Sheesh!

First off, as frustrating as it might be, no one has definitive proof over exact vitamin needs. The advice people give is based on what worked for them and what they have seen work (and in some cases  not work) for other people but people can be different and there are some people that do multiple ADEK combos and report doing fine with their labs. 

I look at it as there being 2 schools of thought. Start with your Doc list or something close and adjust up or start with something like the vitalady list and cut back. My decision was to figure a starting point and work up.

Experience counts though so you have to weigh that against your Doc's list. Personally I don't find it a bad starter list as long as you are paying close attention to post-op labs. I would probably be inclined to take 5K b12 and of course more Vit D.

5k of Vit D saw my level going down as did 10 to 20k. I eventually raised my labs a little at 50k and more when I went to 50k twice a day. I didn't add zinc, A or ****il my labs pointed out the need

I think Docs like to start with the flintstones mostly because they are chewable and easy to take early on. 

I recently looked at multi ADEK's (bariatric advantage) based on my NUT's recommendation but found them a lot more expensive than buying separate and based on my labs the amounts were just too low.

lastly, I just think Doc's and NUTs want you to start with their list so they can have some control. The amounts people talk about here are not going to get you in trouble but it's easy to imagine someone deciding to take mega doses of all the wrong things if they are looking in the wrong places. Here, people have the benefit of living with our bodies and our vitamin needs. I've never seen anyone complain about a vitamin overdose except for B6 which a few people seem extra sensitive to.

Taking 150k of D a day my D was trending down.  With Vitalady's advice, I added in another dose of calcium 6/day which lowered my PTH and helped the D.  I had to change whenI took my dry vits to the middle of night to raise my A & D to the top.  I can't take a B complex as my B6 goes through the roof.  I do take B1 and B12.  If you can get your labs done before surgery, and adjust now, it's easier.  There's a spreadsheet for results of your labs.  I pull mine off after labs and enter in to see where my levels are.  Everything looks great doesn't work for me.  A Kaiser Dr called me frantic that my D was 114 and was way to high, I told him that my D was fine, but why didn't he warn me that my potassium was 3.2, which was very low.  They haven't called me since.  I do have to take a prescription potassium.  Everyone is different.  I tried taking the chewables right after my DS, but the sorbital  in the chewables kept my stools very loose for months before I read the labels.  Petite calcium are small, but you need to take 3 for one dose.  I also tried the UpCalD, but you only get 190 elemental from the powder.

UpCalD:  They say 500 elemental per one tiny scoop of the powder.   Can you tell me where you got your number? 

I did lots of searching on this board and it seemed like the people who got into serious problems with calcium all switched at least part of their calcium dose to UpCalD.  I take it twice a day.  The powder easily disappears into a drink and to me it causes much less constipation than those huge mummy pills. 

I understand, YMMV, but I'm now officially worried about the 190 elemental number you quote. 

I had the SADi (Single Loop) DS in Nov and the recommendation was a little different. The view was less vitamins the first 3 to 6 months, then see what the blood what shows. So far I feel really good and the weight has averaged about 25lbs per months.

Calcium Citrate - 2 Pills once a day

Centrum Multi vitamin (Not Flintstones) which is much better and broader in the vitamins

Iron - 65mg x 2 pills (can't take within 2 hours of calcium or dairy products)

A,D,E, K - The D is only 2k mg

Separately, I take omeprazole for acid reflux and HumaPro Protein Pills (5) to get extra protein in my system.

I think I've decided to moderately supplement on top of what the Dr instructed and then adjust as needed depending on the labs.  I've given this a lot of thought and I just can't bring myself to take massive doses unless they are needed.  Appreciate the feedback everyone!

On the merit of Flintstones:  at first I did kind of laugh these off as a child's vitamin only but I looked and compared against Centrum Complete.  Flintstones is surprisingly close in most vitamins and in some cases surpasses Centrum.  Centrum does have a few more minerals but overall one Flintstones chewable is damn close to a standard adult multivitamin, I had no idea!  In any case they are easy to take and I like the taste.  One less pill as far as I'm concerned.

Vitamin A and D supplement:  Beyond the Vit A and D that I am getting from my regiment above, I found these awesome drops from SeekingHealth.com (they sell on amazon too).  It's sublingual but you essentially take a drop of Vit A for 5000 IU or a drop of Vit D for 2000 IU.  There are hundreds of doses in a single bottle and they are cheap.  They get absorbed in the mouth, what more could one ask for!

Vitamin K supplement:  found these awesome Vitamin K1/K2 fast-dissolve tablets which you absorb through your mouth.

Still searching for a Vitamin E supplement but I have my eye on something like this..  

Bottom line, I will end my day with around 20k IU Vit A, 20k IU Vit D, 1200 IU Vit E, and 2000 mcg Vit K.  I think this is a common sense starting point.  My entire vitamin regimen is either chewable, liquid or drops  :)   Not a single pill other than the one I have for hypertension.

there is a large acceptable limit to proper supplementation, what you were given is not acceptable, for many reasons.  There are many factors on what  a patient needs for proper supplementation (age, gender, limb lenghts, patient health etc)  With a true DS the cchannel is what dictates % of fat that is absorbed, typically for a DSer about 20%, again factors wil influence this.  It is only logical with a large population of the country as Vit D def now add a DS on top of that, with the amount you will be taking you, you will be deficient in no time.  As a DSer with fat malabsorption, it is difficult to normalize yourself after you are trending downwards for a while.  And anyone with a MD after their name should NEVER suggest their DS patient to take flinstone vitamins, that is absurd, and that is putting it mildly.  That is a red flag, suggestion of flintstones will just demonstrate how inappropriate the other vitamins list that they suggest is.  It really is trial and error to a certain degree, but with that list you have you will be deficient in no time.  You dont have to be conflicted, you have a decision to make, and you stated it, give it a chance to fail, I will tell you that is a long hard road to recover from.  No I would have NEVER started on the above amount, while I personally don't think you need to start out with the full dose vitalady vitamin list-you are going in the complete opposite and you will get in trouble.  I completly agree with warning people of high doses of vitamins, and yes they can do a significant harm, but your Dr and Nut have no biochemical understanding of short gut, or fat malabsorption or they would not give you that list.  Please be careful, it is you that will pay the price, metabolic bone disease, blindness, excessive bleeding, etc.