My thoughts about WLS and who should have (WARNING: Big Opinions You Might Not Like)
I've never been on this board before but came this time because of a link on the R and R board. And I am going to join in!
You have every right to your opinion but how dare you inflict it on others by gently pointing out to "chubby people" that there is a better way to lose weight and anyhow they don't need to?
I was one of your lightweights at BMI of 43. To heck with fat being beautiful and all that total "(&%. I don't care what the long term studies are yet to show. I now have a BMI of 23 and I am happy, healthy and have renewed vigour and zest for life. My heart is not under the strain of my weight, my joints are not carrying an extra load.
I was not able to do this on my own. So why on earth should I deny msyelf the wonderful opportunity of WLS? Or should I have waited until i was in the extreme physical condition you were in? I could ask how on earth you ever allowed yourself to get that big, but that would be personal so, unlike you, I won't.
Kate
Highest 290, Banded - 248 Lowest 139 (too thin!). Comfort zone 155-165.
Happily banded since May 2006. Regain of 28lbs 2013-14. ALL GONE!
But some has returned! Up to 175, argh! Off we go again,
You ignorance is astounding and it actually staggers me. Who are you to judge other peoples lives? You arent a doctor and you obviously based your opinions on limited knowlege. My BMI is about 45. I have diabetes, arthritis and other obesity related problems. I use a wheelchair because I can't physically carry myself around anymore. You are such an ignorant hypocrite. WLS is okay for your big ass but anyone smaller should just happy with their obesity? You need to stop the double standard get real with yourself. People with my BMI don't get weight loss surgery because society has pressued them to lose weight. They do it to improve their health, to have longer and more productive lives. You have to be the most ignorant fat person I've ever met.
Ok, so let me get this right YOU (OP) convinced yourself you were happy and at ease with your size...SO WHY THE F*** DID YOU GET THE DS? Now you are knocking those of us who have, WTF cares what you think or believe. As I have asked repeated PE teachers who have told my daughters that they are unhealthy because of their heart rates (whole other issue true but yet similar). WHEN YOU PUT AN MD behind your name I will THINK about what you have to say.
At this point, I probably BARELY fit your "profile" of what you should be in BMI before having the DS (or other WLS) at 53.5 BMI at surgery date. HOWEVER....my DOCTOR (who DOES have the MD behind his name) informed me that I was killing myself. SOMETHING had to be done. I have family histories of:
1) type II diabetes (both sides of the family and to the point of having MANY family members die from it, EVEN WITH MEDICATIONS AND DIET, which you do NOT seem to understand at all, Diabetes is a KILLER, no matter what it will eventually get YOU!) and I was borderline at beginning of journey and like would today be on insulin due to it.
2) High blood pressure ~~ I had it already it was affecting all aspects of my life because it was becoming uncontrolled, don't tell me diet can save this one either, I do NOT use excessive salt, did not eat high fats or any of the other things that can affect this, it is HEREDITARY
3) Strokes~~ my grandmother died from at age 62 my mother died from one at age 56, again hereditary
4) heart attacks ~~ tell me that they are related to weight and I'll hunt you down. THEY DO NOT! My father had a quad by pass about 3 years ago, guess what he is NOT overweight ....his cholesterol is perfect neither a factor again....go to hereditary
5) MORBID obesity...yep huge family history....and no one with it in my family could diet to lose it! I grew up with the jokes, the self preservation of why they / we were like we were (my mom's fav....I'm tall (she was 5'2") I just laid down to grow). NOW they are discovering this too is hereditary, in the genes....
6) CANCER....and already one episode with a possiblity of it, thank GOD it was false.
How many did I deal with and from what weight?
1) high blood pressure (38 yrs/260 lbs))
2) morbid obesity (12 yrs/ starting wt about 175 @ 5' 4")
3) diabetes (border line @ 40 yrs/275 lbs)
5) Arthritis (feet, knees, back, hip, to the point of being deemed fully disabled at the age of 36/250lbs) Though in HIGH SCHOOL I started having knee problems (so if you really look at it I was about 175-180 lbs when it started)
6) Chronic depression (from about 30 on, diagnosed after 35)
7) sleep apnea type problems (on oxygen from the time I was about 275lbs)
8) GERD
9) Fibromyalgia
10) IBS
Life QUALITY???? You don't discuss this at all....what have I LOST of my life because of my weight? What price or BMI do you put on that? When is it OK for family members to make up for things you can't do or lose out on things that you can't do? Do you want to explain to a child of 3-4 why mommy can't help with the school things because she can't stand long enough to help out? Or do you want to explain to your high school student that you can't go to music concerts because it is too far to walk to even get inside the building AND that if you got into the building you couldn't walk up the bleechers to watch ? Do you want to live 1 -1/2 blocks from the park and have to tell your small children that you can't take them to the park because, "mommy's legs and feet hurt too much" to do it? Do you want to tell you Junior in high school that you can't take her prom dress shopping because you can't be on your feet (OR for that matter FIT in a wheelchair to be pushed around the mall) that long?
Welcome to MY world honey. GROW UP! I think your post has to do with trying to make yourself feel less guilty for making a choice you KNOW you HAD to make without compromising your preaching when you were younger/smaller.
FACE REALITY...YOU can't talk for any one person but yourself and to group ANY other person into the BMI realm is just plain bull****you are full of bull**** go do your research and then head for the nearest shrink cuz honey YOU NEED SOME HELP. YOU can't tell me you felt that you were fine the size you were deeeeeep down.....how do I know????? Cuz I spent YEARS in fact about 20 OF THEM doing the same damned thing, I'm beautiful ....even though I wear mumus....I"m beautiful ....even though I have to special order my clothes or make them myself.....I'm beautiful....even though my only friends are family members..... I'm beautiful....even though small ones run the other way ....I'm beautiful ....even though I am INVISIBLE in the world.
You know what? Today I REALLY AM BEAUTIFUL and you know why? BECAUSE I HAVE FINALLY MADE MYSELF HEALTHY, I discovered that beauty IS NOT compiled by what people think, what you wear or how you LOOK....I've found that I AM beautiful because I can take control of my life now, I can eat and be normal....I JUST WANT TO BE LIKE OTHERS, acceptable BUT overall I want to be FREE ...free of diets, of stares and glares of finger pointing, of excuses to family, friends, children of WHY I "can't" do something ...with the help of the DS and Dr. Sudan and all the people here... THANK GOD it was available...cuz I wouldn't be here IF at all had I not done it....
At this point, I probably BARELY fit your "profile" of what you should be in BMI before having the DS (or other WLS) at 53.5 BMI at surgery date. HOWEVER....my DOCTOR (who DOES have the MD behind his name) informed me that I was killing myself. SOMETHING had to be done. I have family histories of:
1) type II diabetes (both sides of the family and to the point of having MANY family members die from it, EVEN WITH MEDICATIONS AND DIET, which you do NOT seem to understand at all, Diabetes is a KILLER, no matter what it will eventually get YOU!) and I was borderline at beginning of journey and like would today be on insulin due to it.
2) High blood pressure ~~ I had it already it was affecting all aspects of my life because it was becoming uncontrolled, don't tell me diet can save this one either, I do NOT use excessive salt, did not eat high fats or any of the other things that can affect this, it is HEREDITARY
3) Strokes~~ my grandmother died from at age 62 my mother died from one at age 56, again hereditary
4) heart attacks ~~ tell me that they are related to weight and I'll hunt you down. THEY DO NOT! My father had a quad by pass about 3 years ago, guess what he is NOT overweight ....his cholesterol is perfect neither a factor again....go to hereditary
5) MORBID obesity...yep huge family history....and no one with it in my family could diet to lose it! I grew up with the jokes, the self preservation of why they / we were like we were (my mom's fav....I'm tall (she was 5'2") I just laid down to grow). NOW they are discovering this too is hereditary, in the genes....
6) CANCER....and already one episode with a possiblity of it, thank GOD it was false.
How many did I deal with and from what weight?
1) high blood pressure (38 yrs/260 lbs))
2) morbid obesity (12 yrs/ starting wt about 175 @ 5' 4")
3) diabetes (border line @ 40 yrs/275 lbs)
5) Arthritis (feet, knees, back, hip, to the point of being deemed fully disabled at the age of 36/250lbs) Though in HIGH SCHOOL I started having knee problems (so if you really look at it I was about 175-180 lbs when it started)
6) Chronic depression (from about 30 on, diagnosed after 35)
7) sleep apnea type problems (on oxygen from the time I was about 275lbs)
8) GERD
9) Fibromyalgia
10) IBS
Life QUALITY???? You don't discuss this at all....what have I LOST of my life because of my weight? What price or BMI do you put on that? When is it OK for family members to make up for things you can't do or lose out on things that you can't do? Do you want to explain to a child of 3-4 why mommy can't help with the school things because she can't stand long enough to help out? Or do you want to explain to your high school student that you can't go to music concerts because it is too far to walk to even get inside the building AND that if you got into the building you couldn't walk up the bleechers to watch ? Do you want to live 1 -1/2 blocks from the park and have to tell your small children that you can't take them to the park because, "mommy's legs and feet hurt too much" to do it? Do you want to tell you Junior in high school that you can't take her prom dress shopping because you can't be on your feet (OR for that matter FIT in a wheelchair to be pushed around the mall) that long?
Welcome to MY world honey. GROW UP! I think your post has to do with trying to make yourself feel less guilty for making a choice you KNOW you HAD to make without compromising your preaching when you were younger/smaller.
FACE REALITY...YOU can't talk for any one person but yourself and to group ANY other person into the BMI realm is just plain bull****you are full of bull**** go do your research and then head for the nearest shrink cuz honey YOU NEED SOME HELP. YOU can't tell me you felt that you were fine the size you were deeeeeep down.....how do I know????? Cuz I spent YEARS in fact about 20 OF THEM doing the same damned thing, I'm beautiful ....even though I wear mumus....I"m beautiful ....even though I have to special order my clothes or make them myself.....I'm beautiful....even though my only friends are family members..... I'm beautiful....even though small ones run the other way ....I'm beautiful ....even though I am INVISIBLE in the world.
You know what? Today I REALLY AM BEAUTIFUL and you know why? BECAUSE I HAVE FINALLY MADE MYSELF HEALTHY, I discovered that beauty IS NOT compiled by what people think, what you wear or how you LOOK....I've found that I AM beautiful because I can take control of my life now, I can eat and be normal....I JUST WANT TO BE LIKE OTHERS, acceptable BUT overall I want to be FREE ...free of diets, of stares and glares of finger pointing, of excuses to family, friends, children of WHY I "can't" do something ...with the help of the DS and Dr. Sudan and all the people here... THANK GOD it was available...cuz I wouldn't be here IF at all had I not done it....
SW 308/CW164/ GW 140
Ok, so let me get this right YOU (OP) convinced yourself you were happy and at ease with your size...SO WHY THE F*** DID YOU GET THE DS?
If I may field this question-- "size" and "weight" are different things. You can accept and enjoy the size and shape of your figure and the freedom of your lifestyle-- while simultaneously being torn asunder by the weight and mass of it. In my case, I had to destroy a shape I enjoyed to save me from the ever-increasing mass of it, and for me it was (and is) a very difficult thing to do. A "Sophie's Choice" as it were.
Point being-- it's possible to love yourself as is and still choose weight loss. I did-- I have. I take a lot of **** for it from people on both sides, but it's my life, and my journey.
If I may field this question-- "size" and "weight" are different things. You can accept and enjoy the size and shape of your figure and the freedom of your lifestyle-- while simultaneously being torn asunder by the weight and mass of it. In my case, I had to destroy a shape I enjoyed to save me from the ever-increasing mass of it, and for me it was (and is) a very difficult thing to do. A "Sophie's Choice" as it were.
Point being-- it's possible to love yourself as is and still choose weight loss. I did-- I have. I take a lot of **** for it from people on both sides, but it's my life, and my journey.
"Oh sweet and sour Jesus, that is GOOD!" - Stephen Colbert Lap RNY 7/07-- Lap Gallbladder 5/08--
Emergency Bowel Repair 6/08 -Dr. Meilahn, Temple U. Upper and Lower Bleph/Lower Face Lift 12/08
Fraxel Repair 2/09-- Lower Bleph Re-Do 5/09 -Dr. Pontell, Media PA Mastopexy/Massive
Brachioplasty/ Extended Abdominoplasty (plus Mons Lift and Upper Leg lift) / Hernia Repair
6/24/09 ---Butt Lift and Lateral Thighplasty Scheduled 7/6/10 - Dr. Ivor Kaplan VA Beach
Total Cost: $33,500 Start wt: 368 RNY wt: 300 Goal wt: 150 Current wt: 148.2 BMI: 24.7
'Furthermore, things like diabetes can be managed with exercise, good eating and medicines.'
I disagree with everything you say, and find the above statement particulary patronising, false and insulting. You clearly have no experience or knowledge of diabetes as a disease. In simple terms (because this is addressed to you), diabetes=death. Perhaps not immediately, but since in the UK it is the commonest cause of heart disease, pulmonary disease and blindness, the ******* will get you eventually. No matter what you do, you never see an elderly diabetic who has had the disease for longer than ten years.
But thanks for telling me I should have died from that.
I disagree with everything you say, and find the above statement particulary patronising, false and insulting. You clearly have no experience or knowledge of diabetes as a disease. In simple terms (because this is addressed to you), diabetes=death. Perhaps not immediately, but since in the UK it is the commonest cause of heart disease, pulmonary disease and blindness, the ******* will get you eventually. No matter what you do, you never see an elderly diabetic who has had the disease for longer than ten years.
But thanks for telling me I should have died from that.
DS revision from failed lapband
I wholeheartedly agree with this. The ***** obviously knows nothing about diabetes. No matter how well you control diabetes, you are still at risk for complications. It can happen to anyone at anytime no matter how well you take care of yourself. Good control is no guarantee. Blindness, Kidney Failure, Amputations, heart failure, neuropathy. All these things can happen to any diabetic at any time. Why sit and wait for it to happen if weight loss surgery is an option?
Personally, my mom had diabetes at 35 BMI. I knew that's where I was headed and decided (at 42 BMI) that I wanted to get WLS before I got unhealthy and became a higher risk patient. Then my mom saw how well I did, and wanted the DS, too, to cure her diabetes, even tho, she was only 35 BMI.
Me and my ma!
Jullie, when I saw your happy prior post about getting down to twoterville, I was so happy for you - not just for your excellent weight loss, but because it seemed like you had at least begun to accept yourself as a less SMO person. Apparently my joy for you was premature. This post clearly shows that you remain, at best, ambivalent about no longer being SSMO. That's sad.
What's worse, you are attempting to spread false information about how healthy people can be as MO people.
Did you know that studies have unequivacally shown that being MO shortens your life, generally by about 8 years? MO is a fatal disease.
Did you know that MO is an independent risk factor for numerous types of cancer, including breast cancer, uterine cancer, prostate cancer, colon cancer, and kidney cancer? The list is longer, I'll stop there.
did you know that your risk of developing congestive heart failure goes up with every 5 bmi points above a bmi of 25?
And did you know that for anyone with the misfortune to be MO, the chance of losing the weight and keeping it off with diet and exercise is 4%??
The NIH and AMSBS didn't pick the cutoffs for wls at random. They are based on the risks of having a bmi of 40, or 35 with comorbids, being HIGHER that the risks of wls. Do you really think they were concerned about our vanity or our dress sizes?
You are entitled to your opinions, however warped and incorrect they may be, but approaching people who don't meet your personal criteria for wls (just because they didn't wait as long as you did) and trying to tell them they should just diet and exercise, or accept themselves as they are, or whatever other trite crap you tell them, is destructive and hurtful. You may be telling yourself that you're doing this to "help" them see the error of their ways, but really you're just trying to make yourself feel better about your own decision to have wls. It's like saying that YOU really needed it, but THEY don't. So not true.
Oh, and I rarely use my title on OH, but I will this time. I DO have an MD after my name.
Larra, MD and DS patient
What's worse, you are attempting to spread false information about how healthy people can be as MO people.
Did you know that studies have unequivacally shown that being MO shortens your life, generally by about 8 years? MO is a fatal disease.
Did you know that MO is an independent risk factor for numerous types of cancer, including breast cancer, uterine cancer, prostate cancer, colon cancer, and kidney cancer? The list is longer, I'll stop there.
did you know that your risk of developing congestive heart failure goes up with every 5 bmi points above a bmi of 25?
And did you know that for anyone with the misfortune to be MO, the chance of losing the weight and keeping it off with diet and exercise is 4%??
The NIH and AMSBS didn't pick the cutoffs for wls at random. They are based on the risks of having a bmi of 40, or 35 with comorbids, being HIGHER that the risks of wls. Do you really think they were concerned about our vanity or our dress sizes?
You are entitled to your opinions, however warped and incorrect they may be, but approaching people who don't meet your personal criteria for wls (just because they didn't wait as long as you did) and trying to tell them they should just diet and exercise, or accept themselves as they are, or whatever other trite crap you tell them, is destructive and hurtful. You may be telling yourself that you're doing this to "help" them see the error of their ways, but really you're just trying to make yourself feel better about your own decision to have wls. It's like saying that YOU really needed it, but THEY don't. So not true.
Oh, and I rarely use my title on OH, but I will this time. I DO have an MD after my name.
Larra, MD and DS patient
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