HERE'S WHAT HAPPENED...
Whoa Nelly! Just because I'm a kid doesn't mean I don't contribute. I do all the shopping and 90% of the cooking in our household. Every morning it is me who gets the girls up, fed and off to school before I go to work. In addition, I handle all of the finances and bill paying.
So, now I got you all thinking what a catch I am. I bring home the bacon and I fry it up in a pan. So in addition to being the world's greatest Dad, I'm an incredible lover and husband who more then contributes around the house. In other words, I'm perfect! Well, I'm far from perfect and I have my issues too.
Sometimes with guys it is a matter of not fully understanding all that is being done and how to contribute. Also, it can be the fear of failure in the sense that because it isn't done the way you do it, it isn't right. So rather then face disapointment, it is avoided.
Hope this help!
Well......here's the word from the world's second greatest Dad....I don't do too much cooking, but I'm pretty good at most phases of house work, I trained my wife on the subtle nuances of laundry, and changed more than my fair share of diapers and exibited a genius for the fine art of child bathing!!
Whether we like it or not, we are battling millions of years of evolution. Back in the cave when life was simple, the man went out and slayed the wooly mammoth and thereby fed the family. He came home, rested, and bragged about his latest kill....as well as keeping his mate barefoot and pregnant. The woman tended the fire, cleaned the cave, raised the children, and kept the tribal lore as well as telling the big lug what magnificent provider he was.
Well gang this worked fairly well in one form or another throughout the ages until women's lib appeared on the scene. After some initial resistance, men realized that this was not such a bad deal. If women wanted to come out and join in the slaying of the mammoth, then OK, 2 incomes make for a better cave. Now here's where it get's dicey......Some cave guys were happy to have the help with the hunt, but didn't see that simple fair play dictated that they should reciprocate by helping around the cave. Now the cave girls are getting frazzled and rightfully pissed off!! She was now doing 2 jobs and he's thinking that he can still hang out with his homeboys and brag about the latest kill!!!
While this may seem that I'm making light of the situation and to an extent, I am......This 2 income thing is historically a fairly new phenomenon and we cro-magnons are fairly slow to adapt. So the bottom line after all of this fractured human history is: I agree with Ken in that some guys just don't understand. Occasionally, they need to get slapped upside the head with one of those wooly mammoth leg bones to get their attention!
Mike
OK, now I have to chime in. I have to disagree with you here Reenie. As much as I love you, I see it differently. My husband was terrific about doing dishes, taking the kid to school, sharing the responsibilities and all in all was a terrific partner. What I could not do with him was be subtle. I couldn't say, "The trash needs to go out" and expect that it would be taken out. He'd agree that it needed to go out, but in no way did he take my sentence to mean that he should be the one to take it out. If I said, "Dan, please take out the trash." Out it went. If I made a schedule that said the trash needed to go out every other morning and the big can went to the curb on Tuesday, he did it willingly and happily. This was a brilliant man who had many degrees and a heart of gold, but he very often missed the obvious. I finally decided that I had several options. I could take the trash out myself and shut up about it, I could make a schedule for him to follow or I could let it overflow. I opted for the schedule. I was happy and Dan was happy. Before I resigned myself to the schedule, I groused about why he couldn't just see that the trash needed to go out and what he heard from me was nagging. I finally resolved myself to the fact that he just was not wired to anticipate or sometimes see what was painfully obvious to me. Years later after Dan had died, it was up to me to take out the garbage. I could manage to get the house trash emptied into the big can outside, but it took me months to get into the routine of taking the big can to the curb every week. I think he was probably looking down at me and saying, "It's not so easy after all, is it?"
I have two male and two female supervisors working for me. If I say, "We need to do a cost analysis and time estimate along with a feasibility study and gap analysis", my two female employees will head off, divide up tasks, assign it out and prepare a report without any further intervention for me. The men will also do exactly the same thing if I specifically tell them to do it, but not if I just express it as a need without assigning specific responsibility.
So here's Connie's theory about all of this...
Men are reactor type people. Great in a crisis, perfect for putting out fires, running with bulls and dodging bullets, they run well on adenaline and testosterone. This is a good thing. Great for survival of the species. They react and respond to need, but don't anticipate or forecast well or pick up on subtleties.
Women are great anticipators. So much so that we anticipate doom and gloom many times when it's not warranted. We consistantly see down the road and anticipate what's around the bend. We are the planners, the prognosticators.
I hate dealing in generalities and am usually loathe to do so, but I do think that there are certain traits that we have developed through years of culture, breeding, societal norms and adaptation. I also don't think it has to be this way. Mike and Ken are terrific examples of men who have stepped up to the plate and taken the duties of a partner seriously. I know a lot of other men who also do more than their fair share. I also know men who should have certain body parts removed for creating children and not doing a thing to help with their rearing. I also know women who should have been spayed at birth. Having a particular set of chromosones does not predestine you to be a better provider, nurturer, bill payer, or dishwasher unless you want it to. It's all about choices.
OK, I've rambled on as usual.
Hugs Galore,
Connie
Reenie,
We must be on the same wavelength because you were on my mind this morning.
We weren't the winners on GMA. A woman who designs clothes for high risk babies who need feeding tubes and a woman who gets college scholarships for kids won. We're still going forward with the business. Next week we move into our new office space. We're just plowing forward and I'm trying to keep all the balls in the air.
I don't mind talking about Dan at all. He died at 39 from a heart arrythmia from Sleep Apnea, but the Dan I knew and loved had died a couple of years before that. He suffered from severe mental illness the last several years of his life so I felt like a widow long before he died. It was so strange to see the physical man that I fell in love with and who had been such a wonderful father and partner, but not be able to reach him. Everyone tells me that I should see the movie "A Beautiful Mind", but I can't bring myself to watch it. I still miss Dan and it's been a good ten years since the Dan I knew checked out.
So that brings me to why you've been on my mind this morning. Reenie, I've been really blessed in my relationships in life, which is why I'm not sure I'll ever find love again. I've had more than my fair share up to now and maybe my quota is full. Dating is hard work; there are statistics that say that you'll go on an average of 13 first dates before you'll find someone that you want to date a second time. I'm finding that to be true. The Man is a wonderful man, a wonderful lover and a great friend, but I come in third to his children and his job. I understand this and I respect it, I just don't know if I can accept it. I would never expect to be put before his children, but between the job and the grown children and grandchildren, there's not much Man/Connie time. I'm torn because I don't have that much time either between my day job and getting the business running so I haven't said anything. I couldn't very well demand more time and then be too busy to follow through. After all my hemming and hawing over inconsequential things like his height, I now find myself wanting more than he can probably give.
So here's where all this is leading in my own rambling, bumbling way... It's not easy out here in dating world. I'm not advocating settling or just accepting status quo if you're not happy in your marriage, but I'm saying that it's not easy out here. I don't know Jim, but it seems that you still love him. I'm an old romantic, but I think that where there's love, there's hope. I don't think you can change him after all these years, but maybe you can find a way to accept the parts that drive you nuts and love the parts that keep endearing him to you.
Isn't it funny that the very things that we find attractive at first are the things that drive us crazy later. I found The Man's responsiblity and maturity so very attractive. It's now his responsibility to others that's causing me distress. I'll bet you were enamored with Jim's childlike qualities in the beginning.
Know that I love you huge and I'm here for you no matter where your journey takes you.
Connie
Connie -
I now remember you talking about your husband before. Did he not have bipolar? It strikes a chord because my dad was bipolar.
As for The Man, do you think that maybe things will settle in over time? I know it's hard to guess what the future will hold, but sometimes life is crazy and sometimes you get a reprieve. I guess the "old romantic" in me feels like if he's something you want more of, then maybe you should do what you can to hang in there and create a situation where you can eventually *have* more of... I know that you're busy...he's busy and he has kiddos. But bigger obsticles than this have been overcome in the pursuit of a happy relationship, and if he cares about you like I think he does, then sometimes just a little time will work wonders.
Of course, not being in the situation and knowing it intimately, I can't really speak for that except to say that just like your advice to Maureen, where there is love, there is hope.... 
Dina
Dina Hey Ms. Dina,
Because Dan was a clinical therapist (go figure), as a professional courtesy, no one would actually slap a label on him. They ruled out bipolar though because he didn't cycle, he was just full-time delusional. Medication helped, but after the first break with reality, he never got back to normal. I really could write a book about those years. Everything from him trying to fly down the basement stairs with an umbrella to trying to drop an anvil on my head while I was asleep because he thought I was going to try to put out the sun and kill the sun goddess. Two days later, he was out in the yard trying to put out the sun with the garden hose while chewing on rocks because there were aliens in the rocks who were going to destroy the world and it was up to him to kill the aliens because no one else knew about them. It was Mr. Toad's wild ride. Ah well...
As for The Man, I just don't know. I'm waiting for this bumpy period to be over before I say or do anything. His kids are all grown and out of the house, but he's still very involved in their daily drama. I would hope that this would calm down, but I have a feeling it won't and it's sort of a what you see is what you get situation. Work wise, right now they are negotiating a new contract and he is responsible for the officer rights piece. Most of his time is spent in the law library. He's exhausted so I certainly don't want to add to his troubles, but I don't want to spend the next ten or twenty years doing this either so I'm going to wait until after contract negotiations in a couple of weeks to discuss this. I'm not good at waiting because I'm usually a solution focused person - see a problem, fix it and move on. He's retiring from the Department soon also, but then it's off to a new business venture for him so who knows. This is a guy who served 30 years in the Navy Reserves while being a cop, while having his own consulting firm, while teaching polygraph science, while getting his Phd and on and on. He may never slow down. The other thing is that I'm not at the love stage yet. I can see it happening, but I just don't want to go down that road unless it's a road I'm going to be happy on.
Thanks for being an old romantic with me. I'm going to take your advice and give it time. As usual, you're wise beyond your years.
Big Hugs,
Connie
If I may chime in with one more bit of wisdom........One of the biggest problems facing men and women in their relationships is basic communications. Men tend to say and do what comes to mind and women drive themselves crazy looking for motives and inner meaning in what was said and done. If he yawns and scratches his armpit, he does so because he's tired and his armpit itches. She, on the other hand, is wondering if he's bored with her company, uninterested in what she's saying and God almighty.....is he developing a skin rash??!!! This may be over-simplifying a very complex issue, but in fact, men are relatively simple creatures. While we are perfectly capable of deep and complex thought, we only go there when necessary. Most of my arguments with my wife seem to begin with a basic communication issue. I respond to the surface information and miss the hidden question and I'm in trouble. I ask for a simple black or white answer and get buried in an avalanche of grey and now I'm pissed off!! It's the wonderful thing about the sexes and the bane of our existence!! It's also something to bear in mind when we are fussed up about the behavior of our mates. We are just wired differently. Anyway........there's another of Uncle Mike's half-baked theories on the meaning of life.....I'll go away now.....bye.
Mike
OK at first it was going to be two quick things, then three, but then when I got to five I had to recognize that it's no longer going to be quick. But here are my random thoughts about The Incident.
1- My father used to use a conspiratorial vibe when he was trying to 'bond' with me, and many times it left me with the intimation that he was shooting for "it's you and me kid" against whatever.. as if the only way he and I could be close was via distance from some other party. I don't think my father was always malintentioned when he did that. He just honestly didn't know how to show love. Your husband may have a similar issue.
2- Your recap indicated that you are very concerned about the possible ramifications of her becoming sexually active, and that you want to talk to Jim about it. But you didn't talk to him about it, you sent him out her on his own without preparation. I know you wanted to give her a united front but I guess your front wasn't yet united. Sending him out there to talk to her doesn't satisfy your need to talk to him or your need for the both of you together as her parents to urge caution to her.
3- You are Jillian's mother, not his. When you "suggest" or tell him what you think he should be doing as a parent, what role are you in? You are advocating for your daughter, but you're not necessarily being his wife, and you COULD be being his mother by telling him what to do - which is the absolute worst thing I think you can do in a marriage. His relationship with Jillian is something that he and she have to work out on their own; you can't direct or control it any more than you can control any behavior by any other person--- as much as you might be inclined to do so. I am sure that Jillian already knows who and how her father is - kids have a real gift for insight like that - and it may have been just as awkward for her as it was for him to try to force an interaction that wasn't natural for him.
4- I bring up that last point #3 because I am in a relationship with a married man. Seeking to learn more about what motivates men to cheat, and what motivates me to pursue one, I have read a bunch of books on married men/single women. All the books I have read, including the 'how to keep your husband' books, stress how important it is that you not belittle or make your husband feel diminished - that it's important that in your eyes they see the love and respect you have for them - because it is that EXACT look in the eye of their lover that draws them into the affair. Just something to think about when you get the urge to let him know just how stupid he is, or tell him how he SHOULD be doing something. Leaving a marriage is, apparently, a lot about wanting that look in the eye, and the chance to not be seen as the "F$%* up" anymore.
5- My boyfriend asked me recently what I'd done that day. I told him, I washed the dishes, did two loads of laundry, and vacuumed. When he asked me this, I was feeling guilty/lazy for not also having gone to the food store. So he responds with, "Anything else?" Now - my IMMEDIATE reaction to this is to punch him through the telephone cord. I respond with, well, what chores did YOU do today? Because I knew he had been home all day, playing with his sons, and that he probably hadn't done a thing. Which he confirmed. But when he asked Anything else, he didn't mean anything by it. It was ME who construed that there was some kind of disparaging sentiment behind it, me *****ad it as "is that all?", because I was already sensitive about my feelings of being lazy. So after I snapped at him, about twenty minutes later, I cooled off, and I knew that he honestly hadn't meant anything by the question, and I explained to him that I'm sensitive about how much work I got done, that I always feel that I'm a lazy sack of #$% all the time and I should be doing more. So about six weeks later, it happens again.. different specifics but same thing, I read into it that he was calling me lazy. Again, I apologized, but I asked him, you KNOW how I take it when you ask questions like that, so why do you ask. (In other words, if a = b and you know I can't stand b, why do you keep giving me a?) I mentioned it to my therapist who was kind enough to point out that I can not reasonably expect my boyfriend to always remember my sensitivities and then only ask the right question at the right time. I can't expect him to do that anymore than he can expect me to just spontaneously stop being overly sensitive. So maybe, be aware of your expectations, and whether or not they are reasonable? I'm not saying that aren't reasonable, just, keep it in mind.
Love you,
Jen
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