Another Half-Baked Theory!

WARNING.....I came here today looking for trouble!! I'm posting this with the expectation that it will make some of you mad, but that it will inspire thought, debate, and hopefully, help all of us. If you think that I'm full of it or disagree in any way, don't hold back....give it to me with both barrels!! Of course, if you agree, I won't shy away from a little encouragement!! Connie wrote a reply to one of Maureen's recent posts in which she mentioned drinking with meals which got me thinking about MEALS in general. Out of all of this thought, came forth a theory which has been bubbling around in my brain for some time. The Theory goes like this: PROTEIN SHAKES ARE BULL****!!! (for that matter, so are protein bars) It seems to me that frequently, when some of you have a bad time with food, you talk about getting back on track whi*****ludes protein shakes. Protein shakes are an EASY way to get a sizable amount of protein. I'm convinced, however that SOLID FOOD PROTEIN is the better way to go. Be it fish or fowl or good red meat (not to forget dairy and eggs too!), solid protein satisfies hunger longer and gives your digestive tract something to work on. Protein shakes may have protein, but they are mostly liquid which washes right out of the pouch and doesn't satisfy the hunger for long. Protein shakes were necessary when we were new post-ops and our pouches were healing. Well gang, we don't have that excuse any more and shakes are nothing more than a crutch now. You may say that you can't tolerate meat, but I find it hard to believe that you can't find some form of solid protein that you can tolerate. We all seem to be able to tolerate carbs in solid form, so lets be honest with ourselves are we unable or UNWILLING to tolerate solid protein??!! If you can honestly say that you can't tolerate solid protein, then you are excused. I declare to the rest of you that protein shakes and even more so, protein bars are POST WLS FAST FOOD!! What's that you say??........You don't have time for meals......BULL****!!!! I don't want to hear that you don't have time to care for your own health. This is your life you are playing with here!! One of the reasons that we all got fat in the first place is that we shoved food in our mouths on the run without any thought as to what we were doing. I see lots of us (myself included sometimes) getting back into the same old suicidal ways. If we can't change these ways, we are doomed to failure with or without the WLS TOOL. I will grant you that there are times when we get stuck in a situation when we just can't have a decent meal on schedule. I always keep a low-fat cheese stick or two with me at work for these occasions. I see no problem with using a protein bar or shake to solve these OCCASIONAL problems. My point is that if you are doing this every day or more than occasionally, you are not trying hard enough!! My main point in all of this is that I find that when I take the time to have a good meal with solid protein, I am less likely to graze and when I do graze, its from head hunger and I don't tend to be as bad in my snacking. OK Gang....I've got the helmet and flak jacket on....FIRE AWAY!! Mike

Sorry Mike, I kinda sorta agree with you. I have not been able to tolerate the Protein drinks from day one. Therefore I have been getting my protien from the milk, cheese and meat group. I have not found that to be a problem. The main problem I have is eating a decent meal for breakfast with the Protien I need. If I do that, then I do not have a problem with grazing. The nutrionist that saw me after surgery advised if you got the protein in, then your body would not crave food. I have found this to be true. After surgery my taste really changed. I have problems with what I call "artificial" taste. Most low carb foods have that or the sugar alchols which I do not do well with either. So my rule has been "Eat meat first, add some veggies with low cabs" and that has worked for me.

Hi Martha; I'm glad to know that I'm not alone in this. As far as the breakfast problem is concerned, If time is limited, I have some fat-free cottage cheese with whatever fruit I can get cut-up on it. The fruit makes the blandness of the cottage cheese palatable and a 1/2 cup serving has 14grams of protein and only 80 calories with the added bonus of a decent amount of calcium. I probably eat closer to 3/4 cup servings. I also usually have a small (1/2 cup) serving of a sugar-free, high fiber dry cereal like Fiber One or mini Shredded Wheat (without milk added). This gives me a little "crunchy factor" as well as a bit more protein and lots of fiber to keep the system moving along. On weekends, I break the boring cottage cheese cycle by treating myself to a couple of eggs...another great source of protein. I find that if I can start off the day with protein, I make better choices later. Mike

I think I love you, man! My surgeon had a ban on protein shakes and bars. Her theory was that if you rely on the shakes and bars, you're not teaching yourself to eat properly and breaking your old bad habits. I've always been a meat eater so that's not a problem for me. Anyway, I know that I have to plan well and that's where I often lose it. When I start to get harried and stop planning, that's when I start stuffing myself with crap. On the days when I pack a lunch and a couple of protein snacks like cheese sticks or beef jerkey I stay on track and feel better through the whole day. A protein shake just does not satisfy me. I find myself looking for something else 1/2 an hour later. I will say that I keep a protein bar in my purse for desperate times, but most of the time a protein bar will sit in my purse for weeks. Dr. Blackstone really stressed what she called mindful eating. She said all the things that you said in your post. You have to take the time to stop and think about what you're eating. Taste it, enjoy it, reli**** and pay attention to how your body responds. In the beginning, I was good about sitting down to eat, paying attention to what I was doing and focusing on what I was eating. I find more and more that I'm not focused and I'm trying to eat and drive, eat and type, eat and read, eat and talk and on and on. Maybe that's why I don't feel like I'm really satisfied after I eat sometimes. Thanks for this post, Mike. It reminded me that I've been less than structured about planning my meals. Every once in a while, I take stock of what's in the cupboards and throw out the crap that has snuck into the house. It's time for me to put a bounty on the crap in my cupboards and go shopping and restock the good stuff. Hugs, Connie

Thanks Connie; I'm really not sure that "throwing out the crap" is as important as the structured meal planning and eating. Having junk around the house or not is a personal choice and only you can decide which is right. In my case, I have 2 teenagers and a wife of normal size and I don't want to deny them because of my perversions although they are willing to do so. I also find that if I'm bound and determined to eat junk food, I'll get to where it's sold easily enough!! If I do the right things otherwise, the junk food is less of a factor. I actually like to keep a large bag of pretzels in the house for myself. I really enjoy them and don't see any reason to deny myself everything I like. The whole idea as I see it is to try to train myself to enjoy food without letting it control me. If I keep up the liquid and protein intake, I'll have a handful of pretzels at night and really enjoy them! If I don't do the right thing during the day, I'l eat half the damn bag, not enjoy them and be angry at myself for being an idiot! It's all part of the learning curve for me. Cheers!!! Mike

Oh, aren't you something, Mr. Michael, screaming at me from the safety of your virtual shield! Try spitting this word-for-word to my face tomorrow night!!! All kidding aside (and I AM kidding), I applaud you and your theory and, by the way, could you kindly teach my husband to challenge me like this on all matters of life??? Now, to play the Devil's Advocate here...my regular doctor ordered me to supplement my regular eating with at least 1 protein shake a day; my protein levels have been reading dangerously low on the last 3 sets of blood work and my kidneys and liver are being affected. Before adding the a.m. shake, I was ingesting at least 80 grams of protein a day in solid foods. Now its about 100. Does the shake satisfy me? Absolutely not. So I follow up with a protein bar at around 9:30 every morning and that holds me until lunch. I will admit that the damned thing tastes good! Really, really good! I will also admit that my Lean Cousine meal at lunchtime is about as satisfying as a peanut; one single solitary peanut. And I am hungry all of the time. Not head hunger, I'm certain of that. I am physically, painfully hungry and I don't think it's related to having a protein shake in the morning. Thanks for opening this can of worms, it's a goodun...Maureen

I guess this means I get a beating at the meeting tomorrow night??? Are ya gonna wear leather too??!! (Just Kidding.....I'm not really into that!!) But seriously folks....If you are getting 80 grams of solid protein and that's not enough....of course you need a supplement. Not that I would speak against your doctor's orders anyway. I do wonder, however why all that protein isn't sticking around better. Are you sure that you are not drinking too soon after eating and washing it all away??!! As for the Lean Cuisine meals.....maybe you need to try something a bit more satisfying? One of my problems with those protein bars is that you pay a high caloric price for your protein and it's too much like dessert and too little like a meal. Bad training to my eye. Just a little food for thought. I'll see you at the meeting tomorrow night, but I won't repeat my post to your face word for word because I'm much too brain-dead to remember all of that blather! Cheers! Mike

Hi Mike, You are not all that off base at all, I did not get into the protein shakes unitl recently. My Doc is one of those that believes we are asking for trouble if we get hooked on them. I mix mine with water only & don't add any added calories like fruit & yogurt like some do out there. I only drink 1 possibly 2 a day. I started them when I got to fighting so hard to get the last 40 lbs off & get below that damned 200 lbs. mark. I have lost 9 of the 14 lbs that I gained and am now at 204 getting closer to that 200 any day now. I got away from cooking when I was living by myself now I am just getting back into it again. & I agree with you that I have never had a problem with my protein levels with just eating food. When I added the shakes in I did start losing again. so maybe there is something with that. No they do not satisfy me either, but, The Champion Whey Powder is the best tasting stuff out there (my Opinion of course) & it seems to be working. I just don't tell my Doc that I am drinking them, as he thinks we should get it out of our food as well. This always stirs up a fight on my Grad board that I am on as well, they were just arguing about this very same thing. Shakes & Bars always seem to stir up trouble, so if you want that fight, you might get it, but not from me. We love you & your comments on this board. Have a Great Day!! Marilyn, the Bearlady

Greetings to you Good Bearlady! As I'm sure you've guessed, I'm really not looking for a fight here. I feel very strongly about this subject and want to stir up a little discussion. The simple fact is that you people are all way too nice and way too important for me to fight with you about anything!! I worry that too many of us use these protein shakes and bars for the wrong reasons. They have their place, but I honestly feel that it's too easy to use them as a substitute for a balanced, nutritious meal. If this stuff works for you as a way to lose weight, then I'm not going to put you down. I just feel that it's very important to try to normalize the way we deal with food. You are a very strong woman and I have little doubt that you will get where you want to be. I'll certainly be here cheering you on!!!! Mike

Mike, I don't think you are wrong here, but I do think shakes and bars have their place. I don't use them for the "slimfast" techique, I use them because I don't think that getting 80-100 grams of protein a day from food is enough when I lifting like I am. I have quit losing, and yes I have gained weight, but my bodyfat is lower now then it was when I was 15 pounds lighter. The only place my clothes are getting tighter is around my biceps,chest, thighs and calves. I actually had to turn in a pair of my uniform pants because they no longer fit around my calves. This is how I use them. I get up at 5:00, start drinking a bottle of water. I run 2- 3 miles and then lift. I have a protein shake and read the paper, get my kids up, fix them breakfast and their lunches if having cold. I eat some eggs or some other high protien breakfast food. Around 10:00 am I have a protein bar. For lunch, I try to consume a food with at least 20 grams of protein. I have another mid-day snack of a protein bar and then dinner in which again I try to get 20 grams of protein through food. Around 8:00 at night I'll have another shake or a bar. This puts me above 100 grams a day. I drink water throughout the day. I also drink IsoPure on occasion when I can't get a shake in due to being in a patrol car or something else. In addition to providing protein, shakes keep you on track to meet you fluid intake. I add crushed ice to my shakes.(Volume without calories). I agree that shakes and bars should not be used as meal replacement, but I do think they can help you reach your protein allotment.