Follow Up to the Marital Issues Post

The earlier post about marital problems and flirting prompted me to write this. I may start a war here, but that's not my intention. I'm just throwing this out and looking for opinions. Don't kill me. I went out with friends the other night. All of us have had wls and lost at least 100 pounds each. One of us is a big flirt and always has been. I'm not making a value judgement here. She says she's a flirt and before the other night always saw it as harmless. Her marrriage is on the rocks, but she has no intentions of cheating on him even though her husband is out of town. In any case, she's doing the usual flirting thing and sees it all as harmless until later on in the night. At the end of the night one of the guys that she's been flirting with physically comes on to her and doesn't want to take no for an answer. His response to her is that she must want him, she's been flirting all night. Her thoughts on it are that she's known this guy for 10 years and he's never responded like that before, why now? This really scared her. Never mind that this guy is the husband of one of her best friends. She says her flirting days are over. I've never been a big flirt, but this prompted me to start thinking about the subject. Is it possible that previously, no one (ourselves included) really took flirting seriously because we were big women and men and let's face it, most of the population is attracted to smaller sized people. Now that we are getting slimmer, people are paying attention and what was harmless flirting before is now taken more seriously by the person being flirted with? As we get smaller, could it be viewed that what was once flirting is now a come on? Connie

Connie, Interesting theory. I am a "flirty" girl myself, and never thought much about it until now. I think you may have something with that "what was flirting is now a come on." I also think, that now being smaller, more men are more aware that I am a woman does that sound stupid? I know that men notice you are a woman but I think when you are so heavy they don't really "think" of you as a sexy, I could enjoy that kind of woman. At least those are my thoughts. I don't think you are starting a war and the marital post issue was MINE! I hope your friend is OK. Bummer about her friend's husband. Nic 291/181/150

Connie, Perception - our's of ourselves and other's of us. Some of us still mentally perceive ourselves as the MO person that they've been for years. A few of us are readily aware of the new shape of our bodies. The outside world generally only sees what's before them, the slimmer new us. That's what they react too. But if your one of the formerly MO people that still has an "image" problem and are prone to flirting, your perception of yourself is still the "safe" one. "I'm fat no one else would want me" type mind set. Then the troubles begin.... The thing that has "bothered" me the most here lately is not flirting but men killing themselves to open doors for me. A year ago I opened all my own doors, unless my DH was with me then generally he'd open them. In the last several months, men have started racing to get to the door to "be a gentleman" and open the door for me. Normally I just smile and say thank you and go on. But of late it's beginning to really annoy me. In the back of my mind I'm thinking, would they have run up here to open the door this time last year? Heck NO!! So you wouldn't open the door for me when I was MO, what gives you the right to "be a gentleman" NOW! I know it's kind of petty to harp on this...but it really has begun to bother me.... Have ya'll noticed this?? Happy thoughts, Va 5' 3.5" 232/148/140? -84 pounds -76 inches

I agree with VA I think the world sees our new smaller bodies and therefore give us the time of day, and I'm with you VA about the door thing... I'm still abotu 80 pounds from goal, but men are doing a lot more than they used to for me... offering to carry bags to the car at the grocery store or open the door, or actually look me in the eyes and say hello or good morning... and yes it is annoying because they wouldn't have done it before... but I guess it's something we all have to deal with in our own way... Lori

I've noticed not just men giving me the time of day, but people in general seem to be smiling at me more and saying hello. The group that astounds me the most is young women. For some reason, I notice women in their late teens and early twenties saying hello and smiling at me more. Maybe a figment of my imagination. So this then begs the question: Are they paying more attention to me because I feel better about myself and am more confident and approachable or are they paying attention now because they are fat phobic and I am in some sort of acceptable weight category now? I really don't have the answer. I do know that men have asked me out who wouldn't have given me the time of day 7 months ago. Of course, they have a snowball's chance in hell. Not only is my answer no, it's hell no! It continues to astound me that overweight people are now the majority. What are the statistics? Something like 53% of the population is overweight. No longer are the obese in this country a minority, yet discrimination of the obese is acceptable, condoned and encouraged. Makes me want to sit on someone. Connie

I think that it's a mixture of the oozing of self confidence and the improvement of our physical self. Being a younger women in my early twenties I actually see a difference that I am now seen a threat more so then before the wls. Women before wls seemed to be nicer to me whereas men wouldn't give me the time of day even though they overweight themselves. Now it has switched women are vicious to me while men are "nicer" and try to give me attention. One thing that I am getting use to is men trying to win my affection whereas before none did. Do people discriminate against overweight persons? Damn right they do! a coworker at a past job who did not have a degree nor work experience vs. my experience or degree made more than me and was promoted due to her "cuteness" over mine. I was harassed if I went out to eat. I remember on one vacation over hearing a women say, " I can't believe she's trying to swim she's just to big." While people tend to discrimnate against overweight person, it seems more people are overweight. Right now 60% of the country is overweight or obese (so they lump the two groups together) 1 person in 5 is considered medically obese.

I've got the matches ready for anybody who wants to flame me. I know this is a touchy subject. I was the heaviest woman any of the guys I've dated were ever with. I think that, in general, we are programmed to seek out genetically sound, healthy mates -- and while society's standards for beauty change, morbid obesity -- the level of fatness that can literally kill someone - is not attractive from an evolutionary standpoint. Just in general, I get real nervous around men who gravitate towards fat women, women with children, and any other kind of situation where the relationship is unequal. I think at least some of those guys are drawn to dependent woman (emotionally, financially, or otherwise dependent) because they're warped in some way and feel a need to control. I don't harbor any grudges against men who didn't "see" me when I was M.O. but who are now giving me attention. I would never rule out dating someone because he wouldn't have dated me two years ago. I'm a different person now. Back then, I was so fat, it could have killed me - how can I blame someone for not being attracted to that? That old saying about how you can't love others if you don't love yourself? Well, being morbidly obese pretty much broadcasts that you don't love yourself. Obesity, alcoholism, and cancer are all diseases -- If I was a healthy, fit person, I wouldn't be on the prowl for a diseased person to settle down with - why would I, when I could probably find someone with just as good a personality, smart, funny, etc. without the weight and baggage? I think we try so hard to make up for our weight by having these amazing personalities and don't give credit to the fact that skinny people can have personalities, too. There are a lot of reasons why I did not love myself in the past, most of them inflicted on me at an early age. I'm working on improving myself, inside and out, right now, and learning to love myself better. My eventual goal is to be mentally, spiritually, socially, emotionally, and physically sound, if not fit, and I would like to meet a man who also has his life together. If it turns out that he never dated a fat chick in his life -- that wouldn't make him a bad person. So, I don't blame those guys. They're not necessarily superficial, malicious, jerks. Everybody is just trying to find the best mate they can. Jen

I agree with all of you. I could write a ton of words here that would match everyones stories. Yes younger men & women look me in the eyes now were before they looked away. Yes men are rushing to open doors for me when before the door would hit me after they'd rush through. And the one thing that saddens me the most? Heavy people who won't look at me cause they see me as part of the other group. To the first two things... I enjoy it! Let them persieve me as "one of them". I worked hard to have this surgery for health reasons, a perk is to eat & look "normal". To the last one I hold the door open for them! Maybe I can make a difference and maybe someday I'll be able to help someone by showing my before & after pictures. And finally, I have the sweetest boyfriend (do you call them that when your both older?) in the world. He cared for me at my heaviest he's enjoying the newer me but he cares the same as before. My ex is severly obese & constantly put me down about my weight even though he was 50 pounds heavier than me at my biggest! Him I won't hold any doors for! hahahahaha Geesh I hope he reads this! HAHAHAHA